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carlie167

Sheffields Rivers

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That's the link to the earlier thread. The latest one I was referring to is at Megatron-Sheffield-March-2010 showing the infall.

I can't seem to get the url's links right the SH site seems to truncate them. The correct thread ends in 48481.

HD

March 2010

www.28dayslater.co.uk/forums/showpost

You need to add links via the post number, in this case post #01 of the March 2010 Thread

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I would dearly love to go down there and have a look myself, it looks absolutely brilliant down there. I think that settles it though doesn't it? The rivers Sheaf and Porter are already mixed when they emerge from the Pond Hill/Sheaf Street culvert.

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I can't see where the Porter does join, perhaps because the people who have gone down these culverts don't like they are very professional and so have made a poor job of documenting it. I guess looking at them they haven't had permission to even enter the culverts and from the state of their clothing and face's blocked, what they were doing is putting thier lives at risk and illeagal too! So they don't seem too interested in historical details as a result. More the frill of doing something they shouldn't. :ph34r:

However from what they say it's clear that it does seem to join with the Sheaf somewhere under the station. So I stand corrected. :unsure:

Nevertheless I must therefore withdraw my remark about how good the railway engineers were and say they did it all on the cheap, not unlike the current lot of AMCO enginers covering the beautiful stonework up with grey slime. They wouldn't get away with that if it was on the surface. :angry:

I will stand what I say though about not joining the two rivers. It would have cut the flooding problem down if they had they kept them seperate, just would have cost more ;-)

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In my opinion the rivers don't actually join under the station but rather given the line that the Sheaf takes it seems to me that the course of the Porter/Sheaf meet just about where the Taxi rank is and travel on in front of the actual station building. If you look at Fairbanks map of 1797 he shows the Porter taking a kink to join the Sheaf at the bottom of Charles Street. Well the river still does that to this day! The Sheaf doesn't appear to be diverted at all as it seems to follow the same course until emerges again at Pond Hill/Sheaf Street which takes it either just in front of the Station or under the modern ticket office. Given where it emerges I would say that it travels under Sheaf Street after flowing just in front of the Station frontage.

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I can't see where the Porter does join, perhaps because the people who have gone down these culverts don't like they are very professional and so have made a poor job of documenting it. I guess looking at them they haven't had permission to even enter the culverts and from the state of their clothing and face's blocked, what they were doing is putting thier lives at risk and illeagal too! So they don't seem too interested in historical details as a result. More the frill of doing something they shouldn't. :ph34r:

However from what they say it's clear that it does seem to join with the Sheaf somewhere under the station. So I stand corrected. :unsure:

Nevertheless I must therefore withdraw my remark about how good the railway engineers were and say they did it all on the cheap, not unlike the current lot of AMCO enginers covering the beautiful stonework up with grey slime. They wouldn't get away with that if it was on the surface. :angry:

I will stand what I say though about not joining the two rivers. It would have cut the flooding problem down if they had they kept them seperate, just would have cost more ;-)

I used to work in the Sheffield Hallam University Sheaf Building over the road from the station.

All the soil and rainwater from this building feeds into a big concrete tank under the basement. from there it is pumped into the sewer on Pond street. This is because some floors of the building are below sewer level.

The designers of the system put a large diameter overflow pipe from the top of the tank into a culvert that was connected to the main Sheaf culvert system. This was to stop the building flooding with sewage if the pumps failed.

Of course what happened was that during the flood in the river, the water back-fed up the overflow and flooded the entire lower basement with the contents of the tank mixed with river water. The water came up with such force that it came up under a bolted down inspection chamber and lifted the entire 12" concrete floor of a laboratory by about 6".

When they eventually cleaned up the place they placed a non-return valve in the overflow pipe.

I had a grandstand view of the event as my office was on that lower level floor.

My carpet was never the same again.

HD

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Not a fact,

just for discussion as it is unlikely that the course of the Sheaf runs as the Crow Flies,

or is that as the Trout swims.

:)

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Confined in a tunnel/pipe the water pressure would overflow at the entrance to the pipe, just like a blocked drain and the Porter would flood the station.

As it did some years ago, with the result that the station was out of action for weeks while they repaired the signalling system. There followed quite a bit of remedial work to try and prevent it happening again.

( Isn't it great when a dormant topic takes on a new life!)

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^ ^ lol:P Take that short-sighted cheapskate Victorian railway engineers ;-)

In one of the accounts I've read it says that the railway company bought the rights to the river in order to build the station on top of it.

Looking at the huge scale of the culverts under the station, I don't think the recent flooding came about because the culverts surcharged, but was more to do with the grating at the bottom of Queens Road blocking with debris and the water came overground down the tracks into the station. Apparently the water deposited a large tree trunk in the station which is possibly still there.

After the flood they installed the self cleaning screens on the two river in-falls.

HD

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Another one of our members, Tollbar Jay, planned to go down the megatron about a year ago.

We haven't heard anything from him since.

Perhaps he is still down there? :unsure:

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Took this picture yesterday of the Sheaf/Porter meeting with the Don on Blonk Street. I have to say it stank and I think you can see clearly see the two different colours of water where they join! But it's still a lot cleaner thanit used to be I guess. I also spotted these stone foundations in the second pic. They ran up for quite a way on the Wicker side of the river. Are they from the original embankment?

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Took this picture yesterday of the Sheaf/Porter meeting with the Don on Blonk Street. I have to say it stank and I think you can see clearly see the two different colours of water where they join! But it's still a lot cleaner thanit used to be I guess. I also spotted these stone foundations in the second pic. They ran up for quite a way on the Wicker side of the river. Are they from the original embankment?

The stone blocks were the foundations for iron supports,

Samuel Osborn's Clyde works extended out above the river Don at that point.

Notice the fish rising on the R/H side of your photograph.

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Some good work been done on this topic

It is amazing and so sad that our city fathers who are always declaring their respect for our city, hills and rivers have done their best to cover all the features up

The best place to see our lovely rivers is nearer their sources such as:

Totley

Ringinglow

Porter Clough

Langsett Area

Bradfield/Strines

All lovely areas

I cannot understand why Sheffield ignores its rivers after all they were the power that put Sheffield on the map and the way the Sheaf has been covered over as in Pond St is deplorable, any other city in England make their rivers an important feature and what do Sheffield do ignore them.

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This outlet is under Ladys Bridge, the photo was taken facing towards the Old Town Hall in Castle St.

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This outlet is under Ladys Bridge, the photo was taken facing towards the Old Town Hall in Castle St.

Looking at the hinge pins above the opening and the way the stone is dressed around the opening i would say there used to be a square iron door hanging over the opening. Perhaps it was an old sewer storm overflow outlet before the sewers were altered.

it doesn't look as if anything has flowed out of it in a long time.

If that is a brick we can see then it looks big enough to crawl into. Perhaps someone on 28 dayslater or urbex has already had a look.

HD

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Took this picture yesterday of the Sheaf/Porter meeting with the Don on Blonk Street. I have to say it stank and I think you can see clearly see the two different colours of water where they join! But it's still a lot cleaner thanit used to be I guess. I also spotted these stone foundations in the second pic. They ran up for quite a way on the Wicker side of the river. Are they from the original embankment?

The stone blocks were the foundations for iron supports,

Samuel Osborn's Clyde works extended out above the river Don at that point.

Notice the fish rising on the R/H side of your photograph.

Found this photograph on picturesheffield

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Brilliant link SteveHB, that is what they are for. I did spot the fish, it made a very loud splash as I took the picture. It's funny I actually had a question about the Clyde Works. Found a pic of them in one of J.R. Wrigley's books and wondered how far they extended up the Wicker but I think I know that know! I am trying to find a pic of the buildings that used to stand on Sheldon Row/Willey Street. Did the Clyde Works go up that far?

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Brilliant link SteveHB, that is what they are for. I did spot the fish, it made a very loud splash as I took the picture. It's funny I actually had a question about the Clyde Works. Found a pic of them in one of J.R. Wrigley's books and wondered how far they extended up the Wicker but I think I know that know! I am trying to find a pic of the buildings that used to stand on Sheldon Row/Willey Street. Did the Clyde Works go up that far?

Sheldon Row, S3.

Arthur Balfour & Co. Ltd. steel converters & refiners - 1925.

Balfour & Darwins Ltd. - 1965.

picturesheffield

Link to 1950's OS

Link to Flash Earth

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<p>

</p>

<p>Not a fact,</p>

<p>just for discussion as it is unlikely that the course of the Sheaf runs as the Crow Flies,</p>

<p>or is that as the Trout swims.</p>

<p><img alt=" :)" class="bbc_emoticon" src="http://www.sheffieldhistory.co.uk/forums/public/style_emoticons/default/smile.png" /></p>

<p> </p>

<p></p>

<p>

</p>

That is exactly right.</p>

<p> </p>

<p>I've been down into &quot;Megatron&quot; a few times and can confirm that the Porter Brook meets the Sheaf at a &quot;T junction&quot; just under the taxi rank and the two then flow together until they meet the Don near Lady's Bridge.</p>

<p> </p>

<p>I'd also like to refute &quot;History dude&quot;'s allegations:</p>

<div>

perhaps because the people who have gone down these culverts don't like they are very professional and so have made a poor job of documenting it. I guess looking at them they haven't had permission to even enter the culverts and from the state of their clothing and face's blocked, what they were doing is putting thier lives at risk and illeagal too! So they don't seem too interested in historical details as a result. More the frill of doing something they shouldn't.
</div>

<div> </div>

<div>How &quot;professional&quot; do you need to be to walk down a river? All you need is a pair of wellies/waders, no need for any hi-viz or hard hats as it is not dangerous, however we normally go down in a group or let someone know where we'll be and a time when we should be back.</div>

<div> </div>

<div>As for the quality of documenting sites on 28DL (and similar forums, blogs etc), I would disagree and say that the urban exploration community is doing an excellent job of recording some of the country's fabulous buildings in words and pictures before the wrecking balls move in.</div>

<div> </div>

<div>Is what we do illegal? Not usually no, trespass is a civil offence for which you cannot be arrested (except for specific sites such as railways, military etc) and there's a &quot;moral code&quot; within the community that you should never cause any damage to sites or take anything from them - it then does become a criminal offence of burglary, criminal damage etc.</div>

<div> </div>

<div>And, of course, a large part of it is the &quot;frill&quot; (sic) of doing something we shouldn't but for me it is the opportunity of seeing something that not everyone else gets to see - from reading this thread it seems there's a few posters on here who would enjoy the same experiences.</div>

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<p></p>

That is exactly right.</p>

<p> </p>

<p>I've been down into &quot;Megatron&quot; a few times and can confirm that the Porter Brook meets the Sheaf at a &quot;T junction&quot; just under the taxi rank and the two then flow together until they meet the Don near Lady's Bridge.</p>

<p> </p>

<p>I'd also like to refute &quot;History dude&quot;'s allegations:</p>

<div></div>

<div> </div>

<div>How &quot;professional&quot; do you need to be to walk down a river? All you need is a pair of wellies/waders, no need for any hi-viz or hard hats as it is not dangerous, however we normally go down in a group or let someone know where we'll be and a time when we should be back.</div>

<div> </div>

<div>As for the quality of documenting sites on 28DL (and similar forums, blogs etc), I would disagree and say that the urban exploration community is doing an excellent job of recording some of the country's fabulous buildings in words and pictures before the wrecking balls move in.</div>

<div> </div>

<div>Is what we do illegal? Not usually no, trespass is a civil offence for which you cannot be arrested (except for specific sites such as railways, military etc) and there's a &quot;moral code&quot; within the community that you should never cause any damage to sites or take anything from them - it then does become a criminal offence of burglary, criminal damage etc.</div>

<div> </div>

<div>And, of course, a large part of it is the &quot;frill&quot; (sic) of doing something we shouldn't but for me it is the opportunity of seeing something that not everyone else gets to see - from reading this thread it seems there's a few posters on here who would enjoy the same experiences.</div>

Welcome to Sheffield History T.T. and thank you for making this first post.

Many of us are interested in the underground course of the city's rivers and would love to know where they are beneath the surface.

Now actually going underground along the rivers course is a bit too much for me, getting on a bit, not as agile and quick as I used to be, - I'll leave that to the younger fitter lads.

One of our members called Tollbar Jay was going underground along the Sheaf about a year ago but he hasn't reported back yet. I am sure he is safe (otherwise we would have heard something by now) but I was hoping for some posts / pictures / information on the site by now.

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Thanks for the welcome, I'm actually based in Doncaster but seem to have exhausted most things round here so I'm casting my net a bit wider - hope you don't mind a "furriner" posting on here!

There may be a few things on my website (link below) that may be of interest.

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Thanks for the welcome, I'm actually based in Doncaster but seem to have exhausted most things round here so I'm casting my net a bit wider - hope you don't mind a "furriner" posting on here!

There may be a few things on my website (link below) that may be of interest.

Don't worry about not being in Sheffield and living in Doncaster,

Some of our members don't even live in Yorkshire any more (Richard)

...and some of them don't even live in the country any more.

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Hello T.T. and thanks for posting. I love your pics of megatron on your site. Do you think I could use a couple of them in a little film I'm making of the rivers in Sheffield? Please.

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It wasn't my intention to cause offensive to the people who explore rivers and underground areas. However although walking down a open river would not be very dangerous, going in the tunnels and underground areas is a different kettle of fish. A flash flood could trap someone and drown them, they could fall and injure themselves. If a group of people go down into one of them, is someone on the surface in touch with them by radio? I think not! I'm certain the emergency services would disagree with people going in uderground service tunnels and pipes, without proper training and the correct equipment to do the job. Not only that members entered a worksite where things were under construction. Worksites of any description are dangerous and should only be entered under the supervision of experianced workers.

The cause might be good, but it should be done under proper conditions with people observing safety rules all the time. I saw NO evidence on that in the websites posted and if young people read these then they could be encouraged to enter such places with a very dire outcome.

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I think we'd best agree to differ History Dude as you have obviously got no concept of expanding your horizons and pushing the limits. I'm not a youngster by any means, am fairly well educated with a good job and a family and I'm perfectly able to make my own decisions as to what is or isn't safe.

I've got experience of the environment and I would say that it is considerably less dangerous down there than it is crossing a quiet road. As for flash floods, the usual motto we follow is "When it rains, keep out of drains", although it would have to be a hell of a rainstorm to push that system to capacity.

Please believe me that there is no need for training or safety equipment down there. But it is up to each individual to make their own informed decision of what is safe for them to do. I would certainly not recommend anybody do anything without considering all the risks, and that includes walking up Mam Tor, smoking a cigarette, using a sharp knife or exploring abandoned buildings.

PS I don't suppose you condone THIS either. B)

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