Millhouses Hotel

[Guest Jeremy]

Does anyone know if the Millhouses Hotel and the Millwright Arms in Millhouses are the same pub?

thanks,

Jeremy

[dunsbyowl1867]

Does anyone know if the Millhouses Hotel and the Millwright Arms in Millhouses are the same pub?

thanks,

Jeremy

If you check on the main list they both appear - with different landlords in 1905 which would suggest they were different? lol

[Guest Jeremy]

If you check on the main list they both appear - with different landlords in 1905 which would suggest they were different?

That's what's confusing me...

In the 1881 census there is Edward Brown (age 42, b. Sheffield; wife = Sarah A. Brown) at the Millwrights Arms.

In the 1891 census I found Sarah A Brown, widow, Beerhouse Keeper at the Millwright Arms.

Then in the 1901 I found Sarah Ann Brown, Beer Retailer Pub, at 951 Abbeydale Road, which is the address of the Millhouses Hotel.

I had always assumed that they were the same pub. So I'm trying to establish if the family moved, or just changed the name of the pub.

Jeremy

[Guest Gramps]

That's what's confusing me...

In the 1881 census there is Edward Brown (age 42, b. Sheffield; wife = Sarah A. Brown) at the Millwrights Arms.

In the 1891 census I found Sarah A Brown, widow, Beerhouse Keeper at the Millwright Arms.

Then in the 1901 I found Sarah Ann Brown, Beer Retailer Pub, at 951 Abbeydale Road, which is the address of the Millhouses Hotel.

I had always assumed that they were the same pub. So I'm trying to establish if the family moved, or just changed the name of the pub.

Jeremy

In the 1925 directory 951 Abbeydale road was one of a terrace of houses between Hutchinson road and Hutchinson lane,(opposite the bottom of Hastings road) - still at that time occupied by a 'victualler'. This terrace can still be seen on Google maps.

Maybe she just changed the name to reflect the situation. The terrace stood between the old Ecclesall (Abbeydale) wheel and the Moscar wheel. The 1890s OS map shows the start of the transformation from a rural to suburban environment.

[Stuart0742]

That's what's confusing me...

In the 1881 census there is Edward Brown (age 42, b. Sheffield; wife = Sarah A. Brown) at the Millwrights Arms.

In the 1891 census I found Sarah A Brown, widow, Beerhouse Keeper at the Millwright Arms.

Then in the 1901 I found Sarah Ann Brown, Beer Retailer Pub, at 951 Abbeydale Road, which is the address of the Millhouses Hotel.

I had always assumed that they were the same pub. So I'm trying to establish if the family moved, or just changed the name of the pub.

Jeremy

I think they are one of the same place, and the 1905 entries in the pub section are misleading, possibly dare I say incorrect. If the information for keepers comes from trade directories, they could be a year out.

Looking at the 1881 census, if you follow the pages through the Millwright's seems to be in the same position as the present day Millhouses. there is only 1 such premises on the part of Abeydale Rd.

If these are the same location the address of 951 is correct.

I suppose the question should be when was the Millhouses built or modernised? At this point the name was probably changed to conincide with the Beerhouse becoming a new pub

[Stuart0742]

I think they are one of the same place, and the 1905 entries in the pub section are misleading, possibly dare I say incorrect. If the information for keepers comes from trade directories, they could be a year out.

Looking at the 1881 census, if you follow the pages through the Millwright's seems to be in the same position as the present day Millhouses. there is only 1 such premises on the part of Abeydale Rd.

If these are the same location the address of 951 is correct.

I suppose the question should be when was the Millhouses built or modernised? At this point the name was probably changed to conincide with the Beerhouse becoming a new pub

Quoting from "Fine Old Sheffield" An historical walk with Henry Tatton page 65 says

"The Big Tree at Woodseats was called the Masons Arms and The Millhouses Hotel, The Milwrights Arms"

[Guest Jeremy]

Thanks Stuart,

I've never noticed this before (and it used to be my local), but if you look at the photos of The Millhouses on Picture Sheffield (like this one) the building looks to have been constructed in two stages. Maybe the name was changed when the pub was extended?

Jeremy

[Stuart0742]

Thanks Stuart,

I've never noticed this before (and it used to be my local), but if you look at the photos of The Millhouses on Picture Sheffield (like this one) the building looks to have been constructed in two stages. Maybe the name was changed when the pub was extended?

Jeremy

I agree, I had not noticed the 2 building styles, see modern day photo from Dave Milner's Flikr site FLIKR

[Guest Jeremy]

From the Whites directories:

1849 -- Joshua Hodgkinson, Beerhouse, Millhouses (White's 1849)

1852 -- Joshua Hodgkinson, Beerhouse & millwright, Millhouses (White's 1852)

The name of the pub is not stated, but both directories also include landlords for the Robin Hood and the Waggon & Horses.

Might Joshua Hodgkinson be the millwright of the Millwright Arms?

Jeremy

[Stuart0742]

From the Whites directories:

1849 -- Joshua Hodgkinson, Beerhouse, Millhouses (White's 1849)

1852 -- Joshua Hodgkinson, Beerhouse & millwright, Millhouses (White's 1852)

The name of the pub is not stated, but both directories also include landlords for the Robin Hood and the Waggon & Horses.

Might Joshua Hodgkinson be the millwright of the Millwright Arms?

Jeremy

Historically it was common to have 2 trades, especially Millers and such like, the beerhouse would be a fallback in the summer when the streams tended to dry up .

Samuel Hopkinson the 1st publican of the Cross Scythes at Totley was also a Scythe maker, hence the name Cross Scythes.

[Guest Jeremy]

Historically it was common to have 2 trades, especially Millers and such like, the beerhouse would be a fallback in the summer when the streams tended to dry up .

Samuel Hopkinson the 1st publican of the Cross Scythes at Totley was also a Scythe maker, hence the name Cross Scythes.

Yer, I've seen that a few times. The 1849 directory listing for the Robin Hood in Millhouses is Eneas Brown, coal owner and vict. Not sure what a 'coal owner' was.

BTW. thanks Gramps for the scan of the 1890s OS map -- it shows my old house.

Jeremy

[Stuart0742]

Yer, I've seen that a few times. The 1849 directory listing for the Robin Hood in Millhouses is Eneas Brown, coal owner and vict. Not sure what a 'coal owner' was.

BTW. thanks Gramps for the scan of the 1890s OS map -- it shows my old house.

Jeremy

Jeremy

You must have seen our map 54 also 53 next to it

Stuart

[Guest Gramps]

Historically it was common to have 2 trades, especially Millers and such like, the beerhouse would be a fallback in the summer when the streams tended to dry up .

Although a millwright would have been busiest in the dry season when the mills and wheels were on short time due to lack of water, and he was well placed for work between Totley and Heeley.

The outline of the building seems little changed between 1890 and 1950; and strangely, although I must have passed it dozens of times on tram, bus and bicycle, I have no recollection of it at all.

[Guest Jeremy]

You must have seen our map 54 also 53 next to it

Yes, one of the first that I looked at.

thanks,

Jeremy

[Guest Jeremy]

From the Sheffield and Rotherham Independent article posted in the Oldale thread:

"Mr. Joshua Hodgkinson, during the lifetime of Mr. Peter Wigfal, built some houses on a portion of the Millhouses estate, and Mr. Wigfall, who was then an invalid, did nothing to prevent him."

Wigfall died in 1828. If these include the house that became the Millwright's Arms this would take the construction of that house back to before 1828, but perhaps not long before 1828 given that it says that Wigfall was an invalid at the time.

[ex cavator]

here is a pic of a bottle in my collection probably used in victorian times in the robin hood hotel millhouses ! kev/sheffield bottles wanted