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Only 510 and 513 escaped. They survived because they were both specially painted for the last tram procession. The story has it that the tiny figures painted as drivers, conductors and passengers in the paintings on the two trams were actually characatures of the tramway management and council leaders of the day! Incidentally both trams were painted differently. 510 carries the wording 'SHEFFIELD'S LAST TRAM' on the ends, while 513 carried 'LAST TRAM WEEK'. This is because 513 was at the head of the procession and 510 was at the back, so it was really the last tram.

510 wasn't the last tram for long though. Within a year or so horse car 15 was back for Christmas, trundling up and down on the disused tracks, making the actual last tram on the first generation tramway one that was pulled by a horse! It also returned in the early days of Supertram, making it the only Sheffield car to operate on all three horse, electric and modern systems.

Horse tram 15 on The moor in 1961

Horse tram 15 in 1994

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Thanks Annie! I've got the original film that YouTube footage came from somewhere. Sometime in the 80's SYT packaged it with another couple of Sheffield tram film and sold it on VHS video from their little travel shop in the hole in the road.

Back with the electric trams, I believe all the vehicles from the last procession in 1960 are still preserved. It's just unfortunate Crich don't take more of an interest in the ones they have. 189 and 264 in particular would be excellen local cars to get back into service shifting the crowds on the less sunny days they get up there.

The tram at Beamish that someone mentioned was the illuminated open topper in the parade (I can't remember the number). It remained open top at Beamish for many years, painted a maroon colour to look more local to the area. Eventually it got a replica top cover fitted and was returned to a more authentic blue livery. It's now out of service having an overhaul, but will be back carrying the crowds soon. I'm not sure if it was new to Sheffield though. They certainly had some second hand cars later on, one of which is rail grinder 330. Although now a single decker, originally it was a double decker and I believe originated in Bradford.

46 at Crich is also unusual because it never existed in quite the form it is now until the very end of operations. It started out as a single decker, but got chopped in half and shortened for use as a snow plough. You can still see the join if you look carefully. When the end was coming in 1960 they did a quick restoration job for the last week, although I'm not sure it ever returned to passenger service.

Roberts Car 510 is generally accompanied by an annoying squeaking sound. Mike Davis (who rescued it for the museum) once told me the noise was due to the Crich workshop not knowing there should be rubber pads inserted into the spring seats. I'm not sure if they've seen the error of their ways and put the pads in now, but I remember the squeak at Crich. 513 certainly doesn't do it.

510 is also the only Roberts car with it's original controillers, including a very unusual integrated air brake. 513 originally had similar controllers, but while in store at the Keighley & Worth Valley Railway they were stolen. Today 513 has controllers from a Blackpool standard car and normal seperate Westinghouse air brake valve, probably also from Blackpool. This makes 510 unique as far as I know because you can drive it using only your left hand, while keeping your right hand in your pocket!

Chas Roberts also built trams for Blackpool in the 50's. If you discount the current purple caterpillars running around the resort, they were the least successful cars in the history of the tramway and most were scrapped after less than 20 years in service. Having said that they were very smart looking machines, but also very, VERY heavy.

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According to both Kenneth Gandy (Sheffield Corporation Tramways) and Ted Gray (Tramway Review No 227, September 2011) there were 15 cars in the final procession: the illuminated stores car 349, the restored single decker 46 and the already preserved 189, followed by 12 Roberts cars with 510 being the last in line.

Of these 46, 189 and the two decorated trams 510 and 513 survive. The stores car 349 also went to the Tramway Museum and was used as a mobile generator before being broken up for spares in September 1967: apparently the truck from this car is now underneath Chesterfield tram no. 7.

The Sheffield tram at Beamish is 264, built in 1907

Another tram at Beamish has Sheffield connections. Newcastle 114 was one of the cars bought by Sheffield in 1941, being numbered 317 and working until 1950, according to the history given on the first 3 pages of this document

There were not many second-hand cars. 20 were purchased from London County Council Tramways in 1917-18 with a further 6 ex-LCC cars purchased from Rotherham in 1926. ALl of these had been withdrawn by 1931.

During the second world war 14 cars came from Newcastle in 1941 and 10 from Bradford in 1943. All of these were withdrawn by 1952 except for ex Bradford car 330 which was converted to a railgrinder. The Bradford cars had to be regauged, Bradford using the rather uncommon 4ft gauge.

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According to both Kenneth Gandy (Sheffield Corporation Tramways) and Ted Gray (Tramway Review No 227, September 2011) there were 15 cars in the final procession: the illuminated stores car 349, the restored single decker 46 and the already preserved 189, followed by 12 Roberts cars with 510 being the last in line.

Of these 46, 189 and the two decorated trams 510 and 513 survive. The stores car 349 also went to the Tramway Museum and was used as a mobile generator before being broken up for spares in September 1967: apparently the truck from this car is now underneath Chesterfield tram no. 7.

The Sheffield tram at Beamish is 264, built in 1907

Another tram at Beamish has Sheffield connections. Newcastle 114 was one of the cars bought by Sheffield in 1941, being numbered 317 and working until 1950, according to the history given on the first 3 pages of this document

There were not many second-hand cars. 20 were purchased from London County Council Tramways in 1917-18 with a further 6 ex-LCC cars purchased from Rotherham in 1926. ALl of these had been withdrawn by 1931.

During the second world war 14 cars came from Newcastle in 1941 and 10 from Bradford in 1943. All of these were withdrawn by 1952 except for ex Bradford car 330 which was converted to a railgrinder. The Bradford cars had to be regauged, Bradford using the rather uncommon 4ft gauge.

That's interesting. From all the film and photos I've seen there has been no evidence of any Roberts cars in the parade except for the decorated ones. I have seen the photos of a generator car at Crich but never realised it was from Sheffield. It certainly loked a lot like 264 at Beamish, but all Sheffield trams had some identical features, probably because of the way most of them evolved out of the same design.

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The stores car 349 was originally car 271 from the same batch of cars as 264, built in 1907 by the United Electric Car Co of Preston.

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Charles Roberts & Co. built the Coronation cars for Blackpool, very heavy as you say and using a different control system, based on the American PCC type, but modified to get round the patents already set up. It was not a success and along with the weight of the cars their energy usage was considerable!

I was talking to one of the workshop guys at Crich about the recent re-build of 510 and there was no sign of corrosion when they had the side panels off, he said it's built like a battleship!

Nigel L

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Newcastle tram 114 was at Crich for a week in September to celebrate 50 years of electric trams at Crich, I was lucky enough to get to drive it on it's last day at the museum, it wasn't until I read the potted history that I found out about its Sheffield connection!

If anyone is going to the Starlight event at Crich tomorrow (Thursday) I will be driving one of the trams from about mid afternoon until we close, come and say hello.

Nigel L

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Charles Roberts & Co. built the Coronation cars for Blackpool, very heavy as you say and using a different control system, based on the American PCC type, but modified to get round the patents already set up. It was not a success and along with the weight of the cars their energy usage was considerable!

I was talking to one of the workshop guys at Crich about the recent re-build of 510 and there was no sign of corrosion when they had the side panels off, he said it's built like a battleship!

Nigel L

Did they put the rubber pads in this time to stop the springs squeaking? :)

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The stores car 349 was originally car 271 from the same batch of cars as 264, built in 1907 by the United Electric Car Co of Preston.

A ha! That explains how I got them mixed up. It's a shame Crich scrapped that tram. The one at Beamish always looks particularly good. Somehow it's not as tall and thin as a lot of trams built around that time.

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Did they put the rubber pads in this time to stop the springs squeaking? :)

Think they must have, it's certainly quieter than it used to be and doesn't creak. Part of the rebuild included replacing resilient pads and parts that had worn out, maybe they took the opportunity to sort out the springing at the same time.

Nigel L

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A ha! That explains how I got them mixed up. It's a shame Crich scrapped that tram. The one at Beamish always looks particularly good. Somehow it's not as tall and thin as a lot of trams built around that time.

Some photos and details of car 349's work as generator car 01 at Crich can be seen in this article

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If I recall correctly the truck from under Sheffield 349 currently resides under Chesterfield 7, I'll check on Wednesday when I'm there again.

In answer to Andy1702's question about the pads in the springs on 510, I checked with the workshops and they were never missing, only not 'resilient' anymore (i.e. had gone solid!). New ones have now been fitted and it is much quieter.

Nigel L

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Once again, thanks for the memories. I remember seeing the horse-drawn tram on static display somewhere near the top of The Moor. I and my friend saw it while on our way home from King Ted's via Pond Street (we would alight from our 54, 55 or 60 at City Hall and walk across the city centre and down LOTS of steps to catch our onward buses at Pond St.), so I would guess we must have made a bit of a diversion to go and see it. This must have been December 1961.

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On 27/10/2014 at 21:28, madannie77 said:

The Sheffield tram at Beamish is 264, built in 1907

Another tram at Beamish has Sheffield connections. Newcastle 114 was one of the cars bought by Sheffield in 1941, being numbered 317 and working until 1950, according to the history given on the first 3 pages of this document

 

Mention of 264 at Beamish reminds me that I finally got to see it in service in April 2017. Magnificent is the word for the refurbishment.

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It also reminds me that there are two preserved Sheffield cars numbered 264. 

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Seeing this and a couple of recent posts with great tram pictures I wonder if there is a way of having an indexed list of trams with pictures where available, but not a jumbled list, for instance, if there was a post  on tram 400, any additions / photo's about the same tram would be added in the same place and be easy to find. I am thinking of something like the pubs list or maps and referring to proper trams and not the new light railway system. Just an idea, I have no idea how this could be done and I am perhaps asking too much.

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I am sure we can come up with something; maybe an index with links to existing  posts and images would be easiest.

I shall have a ponder and maybe get to work on it next year :rolleyes:

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24 minutes ago, madannie77 said:

I am sure we can come up with something; maybe an index with links to existing  posts and images would be easiest.

I shall have a ponder and maybe get to work on it next year :rolleyes:

Thank you.

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Hi

I am trying to find out if any employee records of Sheffield Tramway Company survive? I am trying to trace two of my ancestors who I believed worked there together circa 1880.

One I know for sure did work at STC was George Lyon(s) who was foreman of the Tinsley stables. He was presented with a cup on his retirement as seen in the below clipping from the Sheffield Daily Telegraph 12 April 1883 (kindly provided by Syrup). The other relative I am looking to trace is Joseph Lyon(s) who I believe was George's nephew. Joseph died (unknown) in 1886 and was buried at Heeley Christ Church in Jan 1887.  I like to find out if there were other family members who worked at Sheffield Tramway Company.

 

Regards

 

John O.

image.png.748176629a901c0d429eeea8e6c0394b.png

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I would contact the Tramway Museum at Crich, they have an extensive library of tramway records, and with Sheffield being one of the last systems to close there is a good chance they got most of the records.

Nigel L

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