Sheffield steel for the cars of the past.

[Waterside Echo]

Just had a clearout and found loads of car magazines from the 50s/60s/ and 70s.

[RichardB]

Just had a clearout and found loads of car magazines from the 50s/60s/ and 70s.

Great news. Looking forward to more.

Thank you.

[DaveH]

Just had a clearout and found loads of car magazines from the 50s/60s/ and 70s.

A Vauxhall car made of Sheffield Stainless steel !!!

Unfortunately, there was a time long ago, probably in the late 50's or early 60's (so about the time of this picture) when Vauxhall, along with Ford, had a reputation for making cars which suffered badly from corrosion and rusting.

Fords were "the Dagenham dustbin" and Vauxhall had a similar derogatory name, I think it was something like "the Rochester rust bucket"

Notice this one has whitewall tyres and looks very American as though it is a GM design.

[Waterside Echo]

A Vauxhall car made of Sheffield Stainless steel !!!

Unfortunately, there was a time long ago, probably in the late 50's or early 60's (so about the time of this picture) when Vauxhall, along with Ford, had a reputation for making cars which suffered badly from corrosion and rusting.

Fords were "the Dagenham dustbin" and Vauxhall had a similar derogatory name, I think it was something like "the Rochester rust bucket"

Notice this one has whitewall tyres and looks very American as though it is a GM design.

Yes, its a pity it was only the bright work that was made of stainless steel. The rot set in [ literally ], from the late 50s with the introduction of the `F` type Victor and the `P A` Cresta. I worked for Bentley Bros in the early 60s and these cars were very advanced for their time ,but unfortunately due to the thin metal used in construction and having very little under body protection they were just not up to the job.

[hilldweller]

The ill-fated Delorian car that was built in Northern Ireland was built of Sheffield Stainless steel. I worked at the Stocksbridge steel plant during the 70's and 80's and the steel for them was melted there and rolled and polished at the old stainless department. The body was finished in a brushed finish and was available in a painted version or left unfinished.

A completed car was brought to the plant for exhibition outside the staff canteen. It was a unpainted version and the rough brushed finish was horrible, you could have filed your nails on it. The car had gull-wing doors and looked great apart from the finish. It would have looked much better in a mirror finish or painted.

[DaveH]

The ill-fated Delorian car that was built in Northern Ireland was built of Sheffield Stainless steel. I worked at the Stocksbridge steel plant during the 70's and 80's and the steel for them was melted there and rolled and polished at the old stainless department. The body was finished in a brushed finish and was available in a painted version or left unfinished.

A completed car was brought to the plant for exhibition outside the staff canteen. It was a unpainted version and the rough brushed finish was horrible, you could have filed your nails on it. The car had gull-wing doors and looked great apart from the finish. It would have looked much better in a mirror finish or painted.

One of the problems with metals, especially polished metals, they show up every last little scratch.

I suppose our stainless steel kitchen sink and draining board unit must have looked good when it was new but now it just looks a mess.

Given the amount of wear and tear on a car bodywork, bare metal is never going to look good for long once it is driven out of the showroom.

[Waterside Echo]

A few more `Made in Sheffield`.

[Waterside Echo]

A few more `Made in Sheffield`.

What went wrong ?

[RichardB]

The ill-fated Delorian car that was built in Northern Ireland was built of Sheffield Stainless steel. I worked at the Stocksbridge steel plant during the 70's and 80's and the steel for them was melted there and rolled and polished at the old stainless department. The body was finished in a brushed finish and was available in a painted version or left unfinished.

A completed car was brought to the plant for exhibition outside the staff canteen. It was a unpainted version and the rough brushed finish was horrible, you could have filed your nails on it. The car had gull-wing doors and looked great apart from the finish. It would have looked much better in a mirror finish or painted.

I'd never even considered what the car was made from, or where the material came from. More fool me.

Are there any pictures of the unfinished product anyone, please ?

[RichardB]

A few more `Made in Sheffield`.

Excellent, Thank you.

How does the Gyrocar stay upright ? It looks to only have two wheels ! and is about 20 feet long !

[RichardB]

A few more `Made in Sheffield`.

I want a Steadfast High Speed Hacksaw blade please.

Can anyone define the meaning of "High speed" please ?

[RichardB]

A few more `Made in Sheffield`.

I'll take a Belinda Bedford too please !

The way she holds that enormous ... STOPPIT !!! lol

[RichardB]

What went wrong ?

Probably against the rules now to be that proud of your Nations achievements - never heard of Operation Britain - anyone know any more please ?

Thanks W/E, most interesting.

[DaveH]

Yes, its a pity it was only the bright work that was made of stainless steel. The rot set in [ literally ], from the late 50s with the introduction of the `F` type Victor and the `P A` Cresta. I worked for Bentley Bros in the early 60s and these cars were very advanced for their time ,but unfortunately due to the thin metal used in construction and having very little under body protection they were just not up to the job.

Yes, thin metal.

Keeps the weight down, making the vehicle both more economical on fuel and perform better by giving a higher rate of acceleration

But the corrosion and rust quickly "hole" the metal and make the structure mechanically unsound

To put it in the words of an engineer that I know

"Thickness of the metal in car body panels wouldn't do justice to a sardine tin"

[DaveH]

I want a Steadfast High Speed Hacksaw blade please.

Can anyone define the meaning of "High speed" please ?

High Speed Steel is an alloyed and hardened steel which is used to make tools for working steel (cutting steel with steel)

The hardness of the steel allows it cut other steel without going blunt.

However, when used in high speed machinery, such as drill bit in an electric drill running at several thousand rpm, the tool cutting edge often gets very hot, even to glowing red, and this causes it to lose its hardness and blunt very quickly.

High Speed Steel is designed not to do this, the alloy contains (I think, need to check) a proportion of Nickel which helps maintain the hardness of the tool when running hot due to "high speed" use.

[RichardB]

High Speed Steel is an alloyed and hardened steel which is used to make tools for working steel (cutting steel with steel)

The hardness of the steel allows it cut other steel without going blunt.

However, when used in high speed machinery, such as drill bit in an electric drill running at several thousand rpm, the tool cutting edge often gets very hot, even to glowing red, and this causes it to lose its hardness and blunt very quickly.

High Speed Steel is designed not to do this, the alloy contains (I think, need to check) a proportion of Nickel which helps maintain the hardness of the tool when running hot due to "high speed" use.

Thank you Dave. Was this a Sheffield innovation ? and do we know when and by who please ? I remember my Father using the phrase but I was young and had no comprehension.

[DaveH]

Thank you Dave. Was this a Sheffield innovation ? and do we know when and by who please ? I remember my Father using the phrase but I was young and had no comprehension.

Just as well I checked, it isn't nickel its tungsten and molybdenum which are used to give it the high speed properties, although nickel is used to make a steel which retains its strength at high temperature.

Checked it in the link below which also answers some of your other questions.

Unfortunately not a Sheffield innovation this time

High Speed Steel

[Waterside Echo]

I'll take a Belinda Bedford too please !

The way she holds that enormous ... STOPPIT !!!

Yes, not a bad ad to say it was way back in 1961.

[DaveH]

Yes, not a bad ad to say it was way back in 1961.

But it was supposed to be an advert for a set of spanners,

Not dressed up for the party, - what's that got to do with spanners? :huh:

[Waterside Echo]

Excellent, Thank you.

How does the Gyrocar stay upright ? It looks to only have two wheels ! and is about 20 feet long !

1912 was the year that one of the most extraordinary motor vehicles in the world was built, and remains so to this day. Designed by a Russian lawyer, His Excellency Count Peter Schilowsky the machine had only 2 wheels and was kept upright by a gyroscope, very small sprag wheels fitted on either side were used when the vehicle was stationary or lowered automatically when the engine was stopped. On the 28th of April 1914 trials were carried out in Regents Park and were reasonably successful, but by that time the inventor had mysteriously disappeared, and with storm clouds gathering over Europe the project was abandoned. I believe it is now in a private Mueum somewhere in the Midlands. W/E.

[DaveH]

1912 was the year that one of the most extraordinary motor vehicles in the world was built, and remains so to this day. Designed by a Russian lawyer, His Excellency Count Peter Schilowsky the machine had only 2 wheels and was kept upright by a gyroscope, very small sprag wheels fitted on either side were used when the vehicle was stationary or lowered automatically when the engine was stopped. On the 28th of April 1914 trials were carried out in Regents Park and were reasonably successful, but by that time the inventor had mysteriously disappeared, and with storm clouds gathering over Europe the project was abandoned. I believe it is now in a private Mueum somewhere in the Midlands. W/E.

Gyroscopic precession has strange effects.

It certainly would keep the vehicle upright, but as gyroscopic precession tries to resist any change in movement it would also make it difficult to steer around corners as it would try to resist the turning motion.

The rotary parts of aircraft (propellors or jet turbines) are often set to rotate in opposite directions on each wing (obviously with reversed pitch on the blades to maintain forward thrust) to overcome gyroscopic effects.

[RichardB]

1912 was the year that one of the most extraordinary motor vehicles in the world was built, and remains so to this day. Designed by a Russian lawyer, His Excellency Count Peter Schilowsky the machine had only 2 wheels and was kept upright by a gyroscope, very small sprag wheels fitted on either side were used when the vehicle was stationary or lowered automatically when the engine was stopped. On the 28th of April 1914 trials were carried out in Regents Park and were reasonably successful, but by that time the inventor had mysteriously disappeared, and with storm clouds gathering over Europe the project was abandoned. I believe it is now in a private Mueum somewhere in the Midlands. W/E.

Never heard of anything like it. Thank you for posting.

More details/pictures here.

[DaveH]

Never heard of anything like it. Thank you for posting.

More details/pictures here.

Stuart0742 will probably know more about this than me but there is a Swiss alpine railway where one of the carriages is fitted with a hugh massive heavy flywheel.

When the train descends a hill the flywheel is engaged and part of the momentum of the train is used to spin the flywheel. this has a braking effect on the train preventing it from running away down the hill. At the bottom of the hill the heavy flywhell will be spinning away with loads of stored energy and the train at a nice steady speed, the flywheel can now be disengaged. However, if there is now an uphill stretch the flywheel can be rengaged to power the train taking it at least part way up the hill before its energy is expended.

However there are problems with the flywheel, unless 2 are fitted set to rotate in opposite directions. If not the gyroscopic force of the heavy flywheel is constantly trying to pull the train over and derail it.

[Stuart0742]

Stuart0742 will probably know more about this than me but there is a Swiss alpine railway where one of the carriages is fitted with a hugh massive heavy flywheel.

When the train descends a hill the flywheel is engaged and part of the momentum of the train is used to spin the flywheel. this has a braking effect on the train preventing it from running away down the hill. At the bottom of the hill the heavy flywhell will be spinning away with loads of stored energy and the train at a nice steady speed, the flywheel can now be disengaged. However, if there is now an uphill stretch the flywheel can be rengaged to power the train taking it at least part way up the hill before its energy is expended.

However there are problems with the flywheel, unless 2 are fitted set to rotate in opposite directions. If not the gyroscopic force of the heavy flywheel is constantly trying to pull the train over and derail it.

It may be something historic, I have not come accross it.

All Swiss mountain railways use a rack & cog system, when gradients are steep. As the majority are powered by electricity the do use "Regenerative" braking whilst descending, this puts power back into the system. This is common to other electric railways.

[DaveH]

It may be something historic, I have not come accross it.

All Swiss mountain railways use a rack & cog system, when gradients are steep. As the majority are powered by electricity the do use "Regenerative" braking whilst descending, this puts power back into the system. This is common to other electric railways.

Seem to remember hearing about it on "Tomorrows World" when Raymond Baxter used to present it (so 1960's - 70's)

They were trialing it at the time but nowt never came of it like most things that appeared on Tomorrows World.

It may have been problems with the gyroscopic precession pulling the train awkwardly that went against it

Or it could be the dangers of having a heavy concrete flywheel spinning at high speed in an enclosed metal compartment and the risk of it breaking apart

Remember what happened to your mothers old washing machine when it went into fast spin :o