1841 Census for Norton area of Sheffield

[Guest snooz]

I have been looking at the 1841 census for the Norton area of north Derbyshire. This was before Norton was brought into the Sheffield boundary. I believe that a John Moore listed at the location of Little London was my Great great Great grandfather who was born in 1790. I also understand that after 1835 he went to stay with his brother a William Moore b. 1796 who I believe worked at the Abbeydale Forge from about 1830. The 1841 Norton Census lists a William Moore with his wife and 9 children. His occupation is "scytheman" and back then all the male members of the family seemed to be in that trade having originated in Belbroughton, Worcestershire. The strange thing however is that the location is given as "Bottoms".

Does anyone know if "Bottoms" was an area of Norton back then - or perhaps it refers to the name of some property or house or even farm. Any help you could give me would be appreciated.

I'm really trying to trace members of that branch of the family who may still be living in Sheffield. The only other branch of that family so far as I know that also moved to the Sheffield was my own direct line and I was born in Hillsborough. The Moore name dies out with me and since I now live in California I am anxious to trace any relatives that may still reside in Sheffield.

[Stuart0742]

I have been looking at the 1841 census for the Norton area of north Derbyshire. This was before Norton was brought into the Sheffield boundary. I believe that a John Moore listed at the location of Little London was my Great great Great grandfather who was born in 1790. I also understand that after 1835 he went to stay with his brother a William Moore b. 1796 who I believe worked at the Abbeydale Forge from about 1830. The 1841 Norton Census lists a William Moore with his wife and 9 children. His occupation is "scytheman" and back then all the male members of the family seemed to be in that trade having originated in Belbroughton, Worcestershire. The strange thing however is that the location is given as "Bottoms".

Does anyone know if "Bottoms" was an area of Norton back then - or perhaps it refers to the name of some property or house or even farm. Any help you could give me would be appreciated.

I'm really trying to trace members of that branch of the family who may still be living in Sheffield. The only other branch of that family so far as I know that also moved to the Sheffield was my own direct line and I was born in Hillsborough. The Moore name dies out with me and since I now live in California I am anxious to trace any relatives that may still reside in Sheffield.

Hi Snooz

Bottoms is not an area that springs to mind, however there is a modern day area known as "Heeley Bottom", however I would suspect what we know as Heeley bottom is to near Sheffield to have been in Norton in 1841.

If you look at the pages prior to the one with William moore they cover "Heeley Mill" "Little London"

This is roughly the same are as modern day Heeley Bottom but a little further out of Sheffield on the A61.

I would therefore say Bottoms is in the area of Little London

I am sure this will be expanded on during today.

[Stuart0742]

Hi Snooz

Bottoms is not an area that springs to mind, however there is a modern day area known as "Heeley Bottom", however I would suspect what we know as Heeley bottom is to near Sheffield to have been in Norton in 1841.

If you look at the pages prior to the one with William moore they cover "Heeley Mill" "Little London"

This is roughly the same are as modern day Heeley Bottom but a little further out of Sheffield on the A61.

I would therefore say Bottoms is in the area of Little London

I am sure this will be expanded on during today.

Snooz, have a look around this site, may be of use

http://www.oldheeley.org/index.htm

[DaveH]

Hi Snooz

Bottoms is not an area that springs to mind, however there is a modern day area known as "Heeley Bottom", however I would suspect what we know as Heeley bottom is to near Sheffield to have been in Norton in 1841.

If you look at the pages prior to the one with William moore they cover "Heeley Mill" "Little London"

This is roughly the same are as modern day Heeley Bottom but a little further out of Sheffield on the A61.

I would therefore say Bottoms is in the area of Little London

I am sure this will be expanded on during today.

Having relatives from Norton myself in this era who lived at Backmoor and Maugerhay I have looked up the index in Harold Armitages book "Chantreyland" and can find no reference to an area called bottoms.

I would recommend the book "Chantreyland" to anyone interested in the history of this area of Sheffield.

The book does mention and give the history of a moore (mower / more) family, including a John Moore, in the area but this was in the 16th century at the time of Henry VIII and Elizabeth I.

Notice the derivation in the alternative spellings of the name Moore as Mower. The famous "Greenhill Mowers" could harvest a field of grass in record time using sythes made locally by well known sythemakers.

[Guest snooz]

Snooz, have a look around this site, may be of use

http://www.oldheeley.org/index.htm

Thanks for your input. I shall definitely try this. From separate sources I have knowledge that one of my direct line ancestors a John born in 1789 went to stay with his brother William Moore sometime around 1835 in the Norton area. I ten have a reference that William took over the Little London forge (is this what is now know as Abbeydale forge - the museum?) in 1837. I am assuming that the John and William shown in the 1841 Norton census are these two guys.

Both John and William were born in Belbrougton in Worcestershire having descended from another John Moore who we know was married in the church there in 1641. They were all scythe makers working at water wheel driven forges. All the male Moore's carried on in this line of work - my father being the last working as a scythe maker at Clay Wheels Lane forge up until 1951.

[Guest snooz]

Having relatives from Norton myself in this era who lived at Backmoor and Maugerhay I have looked up the index in Harold Armitages book "Chantreyland" and can find no reference to an area called bottoms.

I would recommend the book "Chantreyland" to anyone interested in the history of this area of Sheffield.

The book does mention and give the history of a moore (mower / more) family, including a John Moore, in the area but this was in the 16th century at the time of Henry VIII and Elizabeth I.

Notice the derivation in the alternative spellings of the name Moore as Mower. The famous "Greenhill Mowers" could harvest a field of grass in record time using sythes made locally by well known sythemakers.

Thanks for the reply. I shall try to find this book "Chantreyland"

[Guest Gramps]

Hi snooz,

A little more info for you....

In the book Water Power on the Sheffield Rivers it is stated that in local directories Wm. Moore was listed as sub-tenant and occupier of the Little London Wheel from 1849 to 1861; so presumably he was living in a house on the site. At the time the wheel was operating as a tilt hammer/forge.

A little way upstream from Little London Wheel was another wheel in Smithy Wood Bottom, this wheel was also known as the 'Bottom Scythe Grinding Wheel' and may be the location alluded to in the 1841 census. There is no mention of a Moore as tenant at this wheel but there seem to be no records available for the tenancy at this time so it's quite possible he worked there and may have occupied one of the cottages.

[Guest Gramps]

Discovered a little more today...

It appears William Moore was the tenant of Little London Wheel from some date between 1833 and 1837.

In White's 1833 directory Wm. Webster jnr. & Co. are listed at the site.

In Pigot's 1837 Trade Directory Wm. Moore appears at Little London Works under the heading of Scythe, Hay and Straw Knife manufacturers.

In Whites 1841 General Directory of Sheffield there is an entry for -

Moore, Wm. mfr. of Scythes (mark T.BIGGIN), Little London Works

and he is also listed there in White's 1845 directory.

A Thomas Biggin was associated with both the Smithy Wood Bottom Wheel and the Little London Works in the 1780s. It seems possible that Wm. Moore being an incomer and not having a registered Cutler's Company mark to use on his blades he bought or leased the registered mark of Thomas Biggin.

So taking this with the other information it would seem that Wm. Moore was associated with the Little London Works from before 1837 to 1861.

Perhaps he forged the blades there and his brother ground and finished them just up the road at Smithy Wood ?

[DaveH]

Thanks for the reply. I shall try to find this book "Chantreyland"

"Chantreyland" by Harold Armitage, published by Applebaum, Advantage book company, 208 West Street, Sheffield S1 4EU

(Didn't that used to be Prestons the chemist and laboratory furnishers??)

ISBN 0 906787 07 6

First published in 1910, latests edition (the one I have) is 1998

461 pages

Cover price is £25 but it has been available for some time in good local bookshops for £5