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togger

Really, really looooooong shot !!

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Afternoon everyone.

Long shot this one. I am trying to:

a. Find the location of the Plumper's Inn, Duke Street, Park, Sheffield

b. A Photograph and a Map location

Here's hoping you guys and gals can help?

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Corner with Crown Alley, but the system won't allow me to attach the map from Work, will try when not being paid to do other things.

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Thanks Edmund & Voldy for the link but difficult to see with the blue filter on the page. Do you think that the central library would have maps that I would be allowed to look at and copy?

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2 hours ago, togger said:

Thanks Edmund & Voldy for the link but difficult to see with the blue filter on the page. Do you think that the central library would have maps that I would be allowed to look at and copy?

Click the button in the top right of the map border (the one that looks like a rectangle with a dot on each corner) and the blue shading disappears. Also you can use the map selection on the left to find a year / scale where you can see the pub best.

Try 1890 at 1:500 scale. That gives a good image of the pub and surrounding streets and buildings. As you move forward in time, the streetscape changes and by the 1954 map, it has gone.

Hope this helps

p.s. clicking the button to the right of the rectangle (the one that looks like 4 arrows facing outwards) gives you a full screen image and works well on a 27" iMac (especially for a cheeky screen grab!) ;-) 

p.p.s. I'd show you with some screen shots, but the upload image features still appears to be busted???

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19 minutes ago, RLongden said:

Click the button in the top right of the map border (the one that looks like a rectangle with a dot on each corner) and the blue shading disappears. Also you can use the map selection on the left to find a year / scale where you can see the pub best.

Try 1890 at 1:500 scale. That gives a good image of the pub and surrounding streets and buildings. As you move forward in time, the streetscape changes and by the 1954 map, it has gone.

Hope this helps

p.s. clicking the button to the right of the rectangle (the one that looks like 4 arrows facing outwards) gives you a full screen image and works well on a 27" iMac (especially for a cheeky screen grab!) ;-) 

p.p.s. I'd show you with some screen shots, but the upload image features still appears to be busted???

Cheeky screen grab lol, I don't know what you mean ;-)

Thanks for the info

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Hi togger,

Her's a link to a jpeg file on Dropbox  Plumpers%201890.png

As I've pasted the link in it displays the map, maybe you can see it also? Maybe the upload facility has been altered to allow display of links content but not allow files to be uploaded to the site?

By the way - avoid putting "Plumpers" into a Google image search, unless you're keen on seeing lots of photos of naked fat women......

A Plumper was a voter who cast an election vote for just one candidate instead of the two which were allowed (ie he plumped for just one)

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1 hour ago, Edmund said:

Hi togger,

Her's a link to a jpeg file on Dropbox  Plumpers%201890.png

As I've pasted the link in it displays the map, maybe you can see it also? Maybe the upload facility has been altered to allow display of links content but not allow files to be uploaded to the site?

By the way - avoid putting "Plumpers" into a Google image search, unless you're keen on seeing lots of photos of naked fat women......

A Plumper was a voter who cast an election vote for just one candidate instead of the two which were allowed (ie he plumped for just one)

I can see your map thanks, though I did the same thing further up and my link takes you to the Drop Box image but I got a message to say the link could not be embedded. I did send a message to Admin.

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18 hours ago, togger said:

Thanks you guys. Now all I require is an image (dream on) lol

I had hoped to upload some images for you and before you get too excited, it's only an aerial photo from 1937

http://www.britainfromabove.org.uk/image/epw055236

If you look at the extreme left of the photo, half way up the frame and just below the large white building, you can just see the Plumper's Inn, on the corner of Crown Alley and Duke Street.

Assuming you have a login to BFA, you can zoom right in an although a little grainy, you can see the building reasonably clearly an how it stands.

Not exactly a 6" x 4" I know, but there's a definite shortage of Plumper's photo's out there, discounting of course the rubenesque ladies, mentioned previously by Edmund?! ;-)

***update*** Thanks for putting the pin on the BFA photo Voldy. The site is a bit temperamental for me and I never got round to it, but realised you'd done it already?!

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21 hours ago, togger said:

Thanks you guys. Now all I require is an image (dream on) lol

If you search on Google Earth for  49 Duke Street Sheffield you will find the Building still standing it needs a bit of TLC.

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2 hours ago, syrup said:

If you search on Google Earth for  49 Duke Street Sheffield you will find the Building still standing it needs a bit of TLC.

I see where you are, but that's the bottom side of the railway tunnel/cutting. That building was there on the 1890 map, but the Plumper's is higher up Duke Street.

Try changing the number to 84 Duke Street, Sheffield. The Plumper's Inn would have been where those trees are, behind the phone box.

I'm getting a bit cheesed off with this 'upload failed' issue - anyone any idea what's wrong and is there a fix on the way??? 

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Hard to explain anything without uploads but I think The Plumpers would have been just a little lower down to the right of the tree on the left in the picture on this link. Crown Alley bang opposite Anson Street would have come out just where the tree is.     ----------------           https://www.google.co.uk/maps/@53.3822392,-1.4582727,3a,75y,77.73h,97.32t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1sM53txC-u1aKzgh7DYvBq-g!2e0!7i13312!8i6656!6m1!1e1?hl=en                -------------------           I think this can be verified on this map with overlay from NLS. Just hoping the links work!       ---------------          http://maps.nls.uk/geo/explore/#zoom=18&lat=53.3825&lon=-1.4584&layers=175&b=1            -------------           (c) Google Maps and NLS

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UPLOAD IS WORKING AGAIN so here is the Google Street view image I referred to above and what I think is the roof of the Plumpers from Bard Street when Embassy Court was being built (c) Picture Sheffield        -----------------         http://www.picturesheffield.com/frontend.php?keywords=Ref_No_increment;EQUALS;u00265&pos=2&action=zoom&id=35736

crown_alley.png

u00265.jpg

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Couldn't post this later on Friday evening though the helpful boginspro's links and Edmunds 1/500 scale plan prompted me to take a closer look at the Google street view (79 Duke Street).

There is a road gulley grate shown on the 1/500 plan about 4 feet uphill (east) of the old Crown Alley from the pub corner.I believe that the gulley on the street view is the same position. Was it intentional, or just coincidence, that the change from tarmac footway to flagstones (also different age kerbstones) occurs as the extended wall alignment of the Plumpers' (Crown Alley frontage) into Duke street coincides with the change of surfacing from tarmac to flags? This means that Crown Place, some 30 feet further east, is the previously un-named access to Coopers Yard on the 1/500 plan. Depending upon the actual width of the Duke Street footway as it is now,then the PH frontage to Duke Street would have been along the back row of the flagstones.  So the 'Children Crossing' sign location would  be a few feet from the old pub corner at Crown Alley (east side). The pub itseif would have occupied the grass verge and gardens of the three top end houses.

Does this clarify (or confuse) the issue? This theory is based on the retention of that same road gulley position for more than 100 years which I believe is very likely.

The debris on boginspro's b/w photo is 'The Feathers' which confirms his identification. 

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So, school lane was behind the Plumpers Inn or first left after the pub?

My Great, Great Grandmothers death Inquest was held in the Plumpers Inn by the Coroner Mr D Wightman on 2nd May 1899. I am trying to put together a visual image of the area surrounding her tragic death. All of your input has gone a long way to achieving this and for that I thank you all. Now, any chance there is a photo of 10 & 11 School Lane?

Thanks once again to all of you

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1 hour ago, togger said:

So, school lane was behind the Plumpers Inn or first left after the pub?

My Great, Great Grandmothers death Inquest was held in the Plumpers Inn by the Coroner Mr D Wightman on 2nd May 1899. I am trying to put together a visual image of the area surrounding her tragic death. All of your input has gone a long way to achieving this and for that I thank you all. Now, any chance there is a photo of 10 & 11 School Lane?

Thanks once again to all of you

I think we reached just about the same conclusion Togger though you noticed a couple of clues I missed. I remember it when Embassy Court was there and that part of School Lane had gone, I think the bottom bit may have become the rear access to the flats, at least there was access in a similar position.  There were two houses above The Plumpers on Duke street between the pub and School Lane as in the picture below (c)    Picture Sheffield      http://www.picturesheffield.com/frontend.php?keywords=Ref_No_increment;EQUALS;s04294&pos=3&action=zoom&id=7802    -----------      Here is also the map with overlay (c) NLS    http://maps.nls.uk/geo/explore/#zoom=17&lat=53.3825&lon=-1.4590&layers=175&b=1 

duke_street_school_lane.jpg

school_street.png

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Ohhhh I like the overlap, that's clever and gives a real impression of where we are at.

Many thanks

Togger

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