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philkai

Woodthorpe Arms 1906

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philkai

Hi

New to the site found during a little research into my past.

It appears my great grandfather James Skelton along with being a farmer was also the publican of the Woodthorpe Arms early 1900's and many of the family originate in the Hollins end area.

I understand the pub is now demolished but has anyone any other details about its history.

The enclosed photo is from a postcard sent by James son we think it shows the pub on the left of the picture on ridgeway dated 1906

Thanks

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Edmund

The 1893 Ordnance Survey map:

From Sheffield & Rotherham Independent Thursday, July 4th, 1867:

“ASSAULT BY A PUBLICAN.—Luke Lawson, Woodthorpe Arms, Intake, was summoned by Samuel Goodlad, collier, for an assault at his house on the 2nd of June.-—Fined 20s, and costs.”

In 1868 the licensee had changed to Isaac Simmonite, but the changeover did not go smoothly (for Rawson read Lawson):

Sheffield & Rotherham Independent, Thursday, October 15th, 1868

“RAWSON v. SIMMONITE - THE TABLES TURNED.—Luke Rawson, of Hallam, labourer, sued Isaac Simonite, of the Woodthorpe Arms-, Intake, for £6. 18s. 6d......Defendant. while admitting the claim, pleaded a set-off of £21 7s 6d., which was made up of overcharges in plaintiff`s bill and charges for keeping two of plaintiffs beasts.....After hearing the evidence, his Honour gave a verdict for defendant, with costs, including advocate's fee. Mr. Binney was for the plaintiff; Mr. Roberts for the defendant.”

From Sheffield & Rotherham Independent, Saturday, October 17th, 1868

“INTAKE CRICKET CLUB. —The closing dinner in connection with the above club was held on Monday last, at the house of Mr. Isaac Simmonite, Woodthorpe Arms, Intake, where a number of the members and gentlemen of the village assembled.”

On 21st November 1869, Ann the wife of Isaac Simmonite, died.

From Sheffield & Rotherham Independent Wednesday, June 15th, 1870:

“WEST RIDING COURT.

Before T. W. RODGERS, Esq., SIR JOHN BROWN, and CHAS.BOOTH, Esq.

BEERHOUSE INFORMATION.—Isaac Simmonite, landlord of the Woodthorpe Arms, Intake, was summoned on the information of PoIice—sergeant Bland for keeping his house open during illegal hours, on the 7th inst. . .The sergeant stated that on the day named he, in company with Police-constable Wilmot, went to the defendant's house, at one o`clock in the morning, and found there a number of men, many of whom were drunk, and for whom beer was being drawn by the landlord. The defendant promised to turn the

men out, but when the police-officers again visited the house at two o’clock they were still there, and defendant, in defiance of the orders of the officers, persisted in drawing drink for them.-—The Bench indicted a penalty of 20s. and costs.”

On October 13th 1870 Isaac Simmonite at a sale at the Woodthorpe, sold of his farming stock, as he was giving up the premises. His stock included 4 horses, 2 cows, 16 pigs, several tons of Hay, and various carts etc.

From Sheffield & Rotherham Independent Wednesday, November 2th, 1870:

“WEST RIDING COURT.

Before W. F. Dixon, Esq., T. W. RODGERS, Esq., and W. P. MILNER, Esq.

The licence of the Woodthorpe Arms, Intake, was transferred from Isaac Simmonite to James Skelton.”

At the 1871 census James Skelton was a farmer of 52 acres and publican:

from Sheffield & Rotherham Independent Saturday, August 17th, 1872:

“INTAKE CRICKET CLUB ATHILETIC SPORTS.

On Monday, the first annual athletic sports in connection with the Intake Cricket Club took place in the cricket field adjoining the Woodthorpe Arms, Intake. The weather was fine but cold, and a numerous company of spectators assembled. The list of events and the various winners was given in Tuesday’s issue.”

In January 1873 James Skelton was still in charge at the Woodthorpe – he advertised that he had found a bull-dog. Another annual Sports took place in August of that year. In November the Woodthorpe was the venue for a meeting of the Handsworth Local Board, discussing the provision of a water supply to the district.

By August 1876 the pub was in the hands of John Cooke

From Sheffield & Rotherham Independent , Wednesday, August 30th, 1876:

“WEST_RIDING COURT.

Before R. N. PHILLIPPS, C. ATKINSON, and W. D.GAINSFORD, Esqs.

REFUSING TO QUIT-.Joseph Jackson and Peter Jackson, father and son, both miners, living at Handsworth, were summoned by John Cooke, landlord of the Woodthorpe Arms, Intake, for refusing to quit his house when requested to do so. Mr. Binney appeared in support of the charge, on behalf of the Licensed Victuallers’ Association.—The complainant stated that on Saturday night, the 19th inst., the two defendants game to his house drunk and requested to be supplied with drink. His wife, who was serving, seeing the condition of the men, refused to do so, whereupon they commenced using the most abominable language towards her. They continued thus for fully a quarter of an hour.—The Bench said they were determined to support the landlords in their efforts to keep peace in their houses, and they would fine the elder Jackson 40s. and costs, and the younger 20s. and costs, or terms of imprisonment in default.”

James Henry Skelton died in the summer of 1877 EDIT- This now known to be the wrong Skelton

From Sheffield & Rotherham Independent Wednesday, September 19th, 1877:

“WEST-RIDING COURT.

Before G.WILSON, Esq., and W.FISHER, Esq.

A PUBLICAN DRUNK IN HIS OWN BAR.—John Cooke, landlord of the Woodthorpe Arms, Intake, was summoned, on the information of Police-constable Wilmot, for having been drunk. The officer stated that about eleven o`clock on the evening of the 31st ult. he visited the defendant’s house in consequence of complaints, and in the bar amongst the company he found the defendant in a state of intoxication. - The defendant admitted the charge, and was fined 10s. and the costs.”

From Sheffield & Rotherham Independent Wednesday, December 4th, 1878:

“WEST RIDING COURT.

Before T.W. RODGERS, Esq. A DISORDERLY PUBLICAN.- John Cooke, landlord

of the Woodthorpe Arms, Intake, was charged with assaulting his wife, Elizabeth. Mr. Wilson (Messrs. Binney, Sons, and Wilson) prosecuted, and Mr. A. S. Binney defended. On the 20th Nov., the defendant went home under the influence of liquor, commenced a quarrel with his wife, took hold of her by the hair, threw her violently to the door, and afterwards turned her into the street. A witness said it was a common occurrence for the parties to quarrel. The defendant was also charged at the instance of Police-constable Wilmot with being drunk and disorderly in his own house on the night in question. Mr. Wilson asked that the defendant be bound over, and he was ordered to enter into his own recognisance in £25, and two sureties of £5, for three months. He was also fined 10s. and costs for being drunk.”

A further similar case was reported in January 1879, though witnesses stated that Cooke was sober and the case was dismissed.

In September 1879 a mass meeting of miners locked out from Birley Colliery was held on the field behind the Woodthorpe. The issue was an attempted reduction in wages by the Sheffield Coal Company. The field was regularly used by miners for mass meetings.

By December 1879 the Woodthorpe Arms was in the hands of Fred Cartledge, who was hosting the annual meeting of the Intake Cricket Club.

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SteveHB

I'm not convinced that the photograph is of the Woodthorpe Arms at Intake,

it looks like Main Road at Ridgeway to me, the school on the R/H side matches up.

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RichardB

I have it listed at 102 Mansfield Road, Intake (but that's not to say Mansfield Road is just Main Road, Ridgeway renamed ...)

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RichardB

From the A-Z :

1871 J Skelton

1876 Mrs Elizabeth Skelton

1879 John Cooke

1902-1910 Joseph R Payley, 2 Main Road.

Mansfield Road appears to replace Main Road sometime between 1925 and 1929 ...

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Edmund

Steve - I think you're right - compare the postcard with the photo on home page of the Ridgeway History site:

http://www.ridgewayhistory.org.uk/

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Edmund

So the pub on the left is the White Swan (Swan Inn) then.

Possibly the White Swan, but an incarnation in between the 1898 version (on the right hand side of the road, possibly the white building on the postcard), and the current incarnation (on the left hand side of the road). I've marked it in red on this 1898 map:

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SteveHB

Possibly the White Swan, but an incarnation in between the 1898 version (on the right hand side of the road, possibly the white building on the postcard), and the current incarnation (on the left hand side of the road). I've marked it in red on this 1898 map:

That is what was puzzling me, wonder if they put the pub name there due to lack of space on the L/H side of road/map, or was there another pub opposite ?

Noticed on some of the later maps that the Swan Inn is not named.

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philkai

Wow thanks guys, never expected so much information how the heck did you find all that in such a short space of time its taken me months on and off to get this far and have just unearthed some new papers that have helped.

Eliza (Elizabeth) shows on 1881 census living at Plumbley farm, married but as Eliza Cook not Skelton but no husband on site at time of census.

I thought James had died in Dec 1873,as there is a marriage shown between Eliza Skelton and John Cooke in Sept 1876 all the dob and children tie up but it now looks that if I have followed that line then Eliza married John Cooke before James was dead? But it would tie in with Elizabeth Skelton and Eliza Cooke being one and the same and continnuing to run the pub and farm.

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History dude

This is actually Woodthorpe Arms in the 1980's.

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RichardB

My finds were all wrong, but based on the information posted at the time not a bad attempt.

Lots of years of experienceplus some local knowledge. Sometimes with a hot topic you might have 200 years of combined experience working on a problem.

Thanks for the challenge; more from everyone please.

Wow thanks guys, never expected so much information how the heck did you find all that in such a short space of time its taken me months on and off to get this far and have just unearthed some new papers that have helped.

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philkai

I have just double checked, the james henry skelton that died in 1876 was only 1year old so definately not a pub landlord.

So the posibility of Eliza's re-marriage to John Cooke still looks feasible.

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History dude

And here's the grave of the family at Gleadless Christ Church.

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Edmund

I have just double checked, the james henry skelton that died in 1876 was only 1year old so definately not a pub landlord.

So the posibility of Eliza's re-marriage to John Cooke still looks feasible.

You're right. The age of the James Skelton who died in 1873 was 47 - that matches the age of the publican who was married to Eliza in 1871:

Which then allows the marriage of widowed Eliza Skelton to John Cooke in 1876:

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History dude

And just to confirm edmund's facts

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DaveH

I'm not convinced that the photograph is of the Woodthorpe Arms at Intake,

it looks like Main Road at Ridgeway to me, the school on the R/H side matches up.

I agree with Steve, but for the a reason viewed not from Ridgeway but from Intake.

I can remember the Woodthorpe Arms at Intake and it looked nothing like the picture, - and the surroundings don't seem to match either. It doesn't look like Intake at all, not even in 1906.

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DaveH

Mansfield Road appears to replace Main Road sometime between 1925 and 1929 ...

We have discussed this before somewhere (link fairy?)

Intake school on Mansfield Road, which dates back to the 1800's still carries an old wooden "Main Road" sign.

Again there is a photo of it on the site somewhere.

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DaveH

This is actually Woodthorpe Arms in the 1980's.

Nice picture history dude, just as I remember it.

Before it closed, and was later demolished, it turned into one of those silly theme pubs.

I remember going there in the 1970's at Christmas because I had 2 friends who played brass instruments (trumpet / cornet) and they were playing carols there.

It is currently a small housing unit built on the same site.

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History dude

The pub itself seems to have been a coaching inn when the the road was the Gander Lane turnpike. It was also part of the Woodthorpe Hall estate as was the Ball Inn and others. I saw some sale documents for the Woodthorpe estate in Local Studies (though they might now be in the Archives) ages ago and there was a description of it in them.

There's another Skelton gave picture, from Gleadless Church, but that is much earlier in date. I will post it if requsted to do so.

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DaveH

It is currently a small housing unit built on the same site.

Site of the Woodthorpe Arms, Mansfield Road, as it was in 2009

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syrup

The pub itself seems to have been a coaching inn when the the road was the Gander Lane turnpike. It was also part of the Woodthorpe Hall estate as was the Ball Inn and others. I saw some sale documents for the Woodthorpe estate in Local Studies (though they might now be in the Archives) ages ago and there was a description of it in them.

There's another Skelton gave picture, from Gleadless Church, but that is much earlier in date. I will post it if requsted to do so.

I have found this article in the Times for the Sale of Woodthorpe Hall and Lands..

The Times Saturday, May 31, 1884.

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philkai

Would love to see the earlier grave stones (are the still there? will have to visit). The first one I do not recognise any names James father was another James we think married to Sarah but then I am at the 1841 census and struggle to find anything earlier

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History dude

Syrup the plans I saw were for that Auction.

All the photos of the graves were taken this year so they are what you would see if you went there.

Here's the final Skelton grave.

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Edmund

The Woodthorpe Arms and Farm was withdrawn from the 1884 sale. The rest of the sale was as follows:

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