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Everything posted by Kalfred

  1. Hello, I was looking to upload a little bit about another Mother of Pearl handled fruit knife that I saw at an auction view. I did not have enough hands when I when I took the maker’s marks on the blade of the knife and was unable to stop a shake. Thus you will see later my improvisation but I think the ploy will help and confirm Liam’s knife dating. The duplicate mark was on a spoon. No confusion 1908 and agrees with the recorded dates for the maker. There is another post and 2 more fruit knives from “Cowlishaw” at the reference below. https://www.sheffieldhistory.co.uk/forums/topic/3761-john-y-cowlishaw/ Thinking now, about to the knife at the auction, it was made slightly earlier and by another silversmith. The blade maker is “AS” in an oval cartouche and that is “Arthur Worral Staniforth” and I looked on the forum and could not find him referenced with “us”. The site “silvermakersmarks.co.uk” gives his silversmithing dates as 1890-1919 and mentions folding button-hook and fruit knife as products. The date letter on the blade is the stylised “g” giving the date 1899. I did view the blade with a lens before the tremors came. The unmoving Sheffield marks again came from a spoon. “Arthur Worral Staniforth” appears to be referenced in the Sheffield Indexers at the turn of the 20th century as shown below. Staniforth, Arthur W. (, silver fruit knife manufacturer). Address: 50 Holly Street h.39 Sarah Street, in 1905. Recorded in: Whites Directory of Sheffield & Rotherham. Staniforth, Arthur W. (, Silver fruit knife manufacturer). Address: 50 Holly Street; h. 39 Sarah Street, in 1911. Recorded in: Whites Directory of Sheffield & Rotherham - 1911. I have just scratched the surface on "A.W.Staniforth" so there must be a little more to go with it. If anyone is interested the auction is 25.8.19 in the far NE of England and is normally on both the well known on line auction platforms. No I do not get cut of the sale price. Kalfred
  2. Hello, earlier this week I needed to look into some history and geography of the Sheffield electroplating company of “Henry Wilkinson”. I referred here to the Forum but I was only overwhelmed with posts about pubs and beerhouses. I think I must bring a little sobriety to the City immediately. Henry Wilkinson & Company started electroplating in 1843. They were the second firm in Sheffield to receive a licence to electroplate and they became Ltd. in 1872. The “Sheffield Indexers” have references for a Henry Wilkinson electroplater before that period though. Wilkinson, Henry (, Silver and Plated Manufacturers). Address: South Street, Park, in 1828-9. Recorded in: Pigot's Commercial Directory - 1828 to 1829. Wilkinson, Henry (, silver plate manfr.). Address: h. Low Street, Park, in 1833. Recorded in: Whites History & Directory of Sheffield - 1833. Wilkinson, Henry (, silver plate manfr.). Address: h. Pond Hill Terrace, in 1833. Recorded in: Whites History & Directory of Sheffield - 1833. Following those entries are 3 more that I assume refer to the “Company”. WILKINSON, Henry (Qualifying property, Warehouse and shops, Norfolk Street). Address: Endcliffe, Sheffield in 1843 - 1844. Recorded in: Sheffield Burgess Rolls. WILKINSON, Henry (Qualifying property, House and shop, 14 Broad Street). Address: Broad Street, Sheffield in 1864-65. Recorded in: Sheffield Burgess Rolls WILKINSON, Henry (Qualifying property, Warehouse and shops, Norfolk Street). Address: Endcliffe, Sheffield in 1864-65. Recorded in: Sheffield Burgess Rolls. Now I think I can ask my question. Below are 2 images with electroplate marks usually attributed to “Henry Wilkinson”. The trio were taken from the net but the single is the mark on a spoon I bought nearly 10 years ago. The pictorial “cross keys” as I understand it, was granted in 1784 by the "Cutlers Company" to "John Parsons & Co" a forerunner company of “Wilkinsons”. The “S” mark was regularly used to indicate Sheffield manufactured electroplated items. My question is about the probable fancy “M”. This is where the geography comes in. Could it be an indicator of a particular area of Sheffield? If not does anyone else have any ideas? Walker and Hall took over “Henry Wilkinson” in 1892 but may have continued to use the name and “mark” for a while. I also found a reference that gave a date of 1828 for the founding of the “Wilkinson” concern. To round off the extra information I will add that Henry Wilkinson had various silver marks registered with the Sheffield Silver Assay Office from 1831 to 1893. "Norfolk Street" was the address and from 1845 onwards the marks were very similar to the “HW&Co” mark shown in the trio image. There were marks also registered at the London Assay office. Do please add where there are omissions and correct any errors in my observations. Kalfred
  3. Hello, I can possibly offer some dating to the knife blades. The oldest of the 2 blades belongs to Adrian's knife. We see the crown mark and know tha blades were marked by the Sheffield Guild and thus I read the date letter as a stylised "u" and it means the silver was assayed just before WW1 in 1912. If the letter is not a "u", but is a fairly similar styled "n", it would be for 1905. George21's blade is wartime but likely WW2. The date letter, a lower case "y", that was used for 1941. The silver website "silvermakersmarks.co.uk" states that after the suicide the silver business was carried on by a son and gives 4 addresses for the base "Market Street, Sheffield; then in succession: Baker's Hill; Arundel Street; Napier Street" over the period 1862- 1950. Kalfred
  4. Pictured below is a carving set which I did not buy at last weekend’s car boot sale. I think you can just have too many carving sets. It carried a name that I had not come across before. Google was useless and the Forum and sheffield Indexers threw up a "tailor" of the same name. I also researched the “Elsine handle”. I found a “German” reference about an “Elsine” razor with a tortoiseshell handle. . Do we know anything about “Elsine regd”? Is it a producer of faux materials mimicing natural products? Are the handles on the carving set faux antlar? Uselessly I have nothing else to add but I think Sheffield Forum members will be able to give answers about this carving set. Kalfred
  5. Thank you "Steve.HB" for this extra snippet of info. Cutlery manufacturers then at least to the late 1950's. Kalfred
  6. Hello, looking for something interesting on line I noticed the 5 inch sauce ladle spoon in the photo below. The maker’s marks “Bennett & Heron” were not known to me but looked informative enough to maybe get a bit more history on. Obviously messes “Bennett & Heron” had put their names on an electroplated spoon that they wanted to tell customers was of “A1” quality. I had a quick search on “silvercollection.it”, an excellent reference site of history for electroplating companies. The reference there suggested “Bennett & Heron Ltd” of Sheffield could be retailers. I had a further search to see if I could find a little extra on the company. Perhaps the extract from the London Gazzette I found, is a starting point. It states up to 1927 they were a company of “Cutlers & Silvermiths”. This is possibly confirmed by the “Sheffield Indexers” entry shown below. HERON, Thomas (~, Cutlery Manufacturer (Bennett & Heron)). Address: 50 Holly Street, ~ in 1925. Recorded in: Sheffield & Rotherham Kelly?s Directory. Who was the silversmith then? I could not find a likely associated silver mark on line and I could not find a reference in the “Indexers” for “Jack Bennett”. I did wonder if the below, 1905, near contemporary “Bennett” reference could have been involved in the company. Bennett, William (, silversmith). Address: 32 Yadley Street, in 1905. Recorded in: White's Directory of Sheffield and Rotherham. We now need more information about “Bennett & Heron Ltd”. When did the firm start in business. Did it change after April 1927? Did they actually develop as retailers and not makers. Has anyone on the forum got any more “stuff” to add for a real history for “Bennett & Heron Ltd”? I found some more photos of “Bennett & Heron” spoons on line but below is something a little different. Kalfred
  7. I checked a few of the listed Sibray Hall & Co hallmarks. They had official marks at the Sheffield assay office and at London. The below mark is an early one for Sheffield, an unembellished letter “O” with a Monarch’s head, so for 1881. It features the initials of Frank Sibray and Job Hall but then, after the death of the former in 1891, there were of marks of various styles but featuring initials of “ Job Frank Hall”. When “Hall” retired around 1900, the company used a “CCP” mark relating to “ Charles Clement Pilling” who had taken the company on. It seems that “CCP” has only been noted on Sheffield or London silver items up to 1922.
  8. The "Sibray Hall & Co" company is an interesting alternative maker idea and the 1931 hallmark date does not totally exclude them. The marks I have posted may have been modified a little at the size I managed to enhance them to. That said the "SH" appears in 2 close but seperate cut corner squares and not in the single rectangle as in yours and the other example on the website I refered to. Silversmiths did however slightly change marks over time and not all changes have been recorded at assay centres. Further enquiries required. Kalfred
  9. Thank you SteveHB and Edmund for adding info to this post. Anybody know about the silversmithing? Did Hall & Co have a base in Sheffield or were the silver parts just "bough in" from Birmingham for Sheffield assay? Thanks Kalfred
  10. Hello is I was trawling through Ebay’s scissors looking for a scissorsmith when I saw the scissors shown below. I was intrigued and I had to have a bid, all be it, ultimately unsuccessfully. I felt I must post a photo, as these grape scissors are certainly “Sheffield”. These mixed metal scissors are easy to date using the date letter associated with the hallmark on the silver finger holes. The unembellished letter “o” without a Monarch’s head, together with the crown (for Sheffield) indicates the assay at the Sheffield Assay Office in 1931. The maker of the silver part of the scissors is indicated by the “S.H.&Co.” but I will reference that later. We can see from the rear pivot area of the scissors that the blades are made of Sheffield England stainless steel and from the pivot front we a clear pictorial probable trademark with lettering below it. The “nest” with eggs in was the trademark of Sheffield’s Southern & Richardson and I think you will be able to “fill in the spaces” to confirm that makers name. These cutlery makers were known at the “Don Cutlery Works” from the middle of the 19th century and there are several images of knives spread around the forum. One of these did suggest the trademark was a “thistle” or has this been a mis-interpretation of the image on a much older and tarnished knife compared to these 20th century scissors. From a reference I think I read on line, technically, the grape scissors may not have been made by “Southern & Richardson” as in the 1920s that named company had been incorporated into a larger Sheffield concern and the latter continued with the trademarks. Hopefully the “forum” can clear this up. Returning to the “S.H.&Co.” maker’s mark now. The website www.silvermakersmarks.co.uk that I always confidently use for identifying British silversmiths, identifies the silver finger parts as having been made “probably, by Sydney Hall & Co”, and gives them an address of “Birmingham”. If there is other information regarding the maker please enlighten us, as there will be would be many interested to know. I hope there are others on the forum, like me, who like and wish they owned the grape scissors. Kalfred
  11. Hello no spoons for me again today. Not all bad though. What do you think? The blades on these scissors are about 3 inches long. We see the "I.XL" mark clearly. On the the other side of the blade pivot area is a less clear mark that I believe says that the scissors are chromium plated.I supose dating the scissors is difficult, but they may well be from the same period as "SteveHB's" Kelly directories ad. Kalfred
  12. Hello can I stir the muddy water a little bit more? This is from a cutlery set. Kalfred
  13. Thanks Edmund In this case it seems the "mark" became the "works". I found another item, sorry not military and not a knife, but sharp non the less. A composite of marks on some scissors below. Kalfred
  14. Hello, have you noticed that that maker's mark on the knife blade looks as if it is an overstrike? It looks to me as if some one else made the silver blade and the "J.F" stamp was put on top. Just around the top of the "J" there appears to be a smaller residual mark of the actual maker. Mr Fenton was likely buying in at least some of the silver blades he was using from a alterative silversmith. Kalfred
  15. The picture below is the 2nd knife I looked at before the auction. I will try to be a bit less boring with this one. This knife was about 4 inches (10cms for younger readers) long. Excellent marks (don’t know about the blades) showing 1945 and the broad arrow. The maker was George Ibberson & Co, and shows their trademark of a “violin”. They are referenced to have been based at the “Violin Works” on “Rockingham Street” 1912-32. Do we know if the “trademark” became the ”works” or if the “works” became the “trademark”? Kalfred
  16. Edmund has nicely bought the John Blyde’s brother James Blyde, (likely born 1833/4 back into the picture again. The 1861 census that described John as a “hardware manufacturer employing 8 men and 2 boys” calls James as a “Surgical ????? manuf”, but it is difficult to discern. Interestingly also in that year, 1861, the old “James” (born 1803) was described as a scissor finisher and you could wonder for whom he was doing that job? Below is a reference that may lead you to a possible 1859 advert for some “Blydes”. http://www.picturesheffield.com/frontend.php?keywords=Ref_No_increment;EQUALS;y03077&pos=2&action=zoom This reference brings more confusion to my mind as I see three options. We have again a company called “James Blyde and Son”. Is this an old advert from the original company James and John? Is this a new company, old “James” and his 2nd son “James”, or for that young “James” and perhaps with a son of his own? To me it is more likely that it is the 2 “James” together. This company’s base is said to be Hall Carr, Spital Hill and referring again to the 1861 census James the son’s address was “Hall Carr Street” and although he had a son, “James Henry”, the child was only 2 years old. Below is an advert (found by forum member “Vox”) referencing 1869, the year of the “flower and fruit gathering apparatus” patents noted by Edmund. Is there anything significant here, as this ad, has a different name, just James Blyde? We also know from a census that in 1871 old James (1803) was retired (living on income from dividens) while young James (1833) was described as “maker and manufacturer” and employing “5 men and 2 boys”. The concern must have been doing ok though as “James” (1833) was surprisingly, in 1881, a retired merchant and “James Henry” was living at home with his father and mother but his occupation was not stated. “James Henry” was likely involved in the business though, as we have come to another of “Edmund’s” notes. “On 5th October 1885 the partnership between James Henry Blyde and Percy Smith, under the name James Blyde and Co. of the Hallcar Works, Hallcar Street, manufacturer of scissors, nippers and surgical and other instruments was dissolved by mutual consent.” I am wondering where “Percy Smith” has turned up from? Could a possibly ailing James the “1881 retired merchant” have got someone else into the company to help his son. In January 1888 that retired James is said to have died. I looked for Percy Smith on the 1881 census and he was an employer of 31 men and 4 boys manufacturing a large range of goods including nippers, meat tin openers and (perhaps significantly for later) steel toys. Was this “James Blyde & Co”? Images of items of “James Blyde & Co” appear in short supply but I found some 8 inch calipers so labelled but sadly of unknown date. Has anybody got any more items from this company? In 1891 we find that “James Henry” is discribed as a “steel toy manufacturer” and ten years on he is an employer and “cutlery manufacturer” and his son “Percy” is then 12. In 1911 “Percy” has become a “Harry Percy” and is 23. Both “James Henry” and “Harry Percy” are described as “cutlery manufacturers” and that leads on to “Edmund’s” last couple of “pieces” about the pair. I have a couple of my own last snippets. There are references that James Henry Blyde was associated with the trademark of a pictorial “well” and a written “well” and “finished”. I could not find an “on item” example of the mark to show. Also again, what about “Percy Smith”? I found him again on the 1891 census as “employed” as a “Secretary Electroplating Company”. Was that for “James Blyde & Co”? Anyone know more about “Percy Smith”? Subsequently he is a “Registrar” of births, deaths and marriages. As before does anybody know more or different about this stem of the Blyde family? Kalfred.
  17. Hello, I was viewing an auction but could not find any spoons to interest me. I did get a good look at 2 knives with “marline spikes” though.The knife shown below is 5 inches long and marked “Wade and Butcher Sheffield England”. Not illustrated but on the other side of the blade was 1936 but I could not see a War Dept broad arrow. However there appeared to be 2 other pictorial marks. There seemed to be a long arrow with quite a bit of “feathering” and also 3 black triangular marks. At home again and research. Wade and Butcher made razors and we can see the pictorial marks clearly. We see an arrow and a Maltese cross on the examples above. I thought I would do a bit more chasing. Earlier in this post “Vox” said that “Wade” was an American agent so I had a look for “Butcher” in “Sheffield Indexers”. I do not like long lists but there are a great many “Butcher” makers of Sheffield “wares” to be found. I have put the names that I think could be chronological originators of the W and S Butcher part of the company. "Vox" said the company began in 1820, but the first reference I found was 1825 but if you consider their range of wares it does look like an established company by that time. Butcher, William (, merchant and manufacturer of edge tools, skates, saws, files, hoes, trowels, joiners tools, West India and Brazil plantation tools and steel converter and refiner). Address: Eyre Lane, Sheffield in 1825. Recorded in: Gells 1825 Directory of Sheffield. Butcher, William (, merchant). Address: Broom Hill, Sheffield in 1825. Recorded in: Gells 1825 Directory of Sheffield. Butcher, Wm. (, Merchant (&c)). Address: h,Broom Hill, in 1833. Recorded in: Whites History & Directory of Sheffield - 1833. Butcher, William & Samuel (, merchants, steel converters and saw, file and edge tool mfrs.). Address: 15 Eyre Lane, in 1837. Recorded in: Whites Directory of Sheffield & Rotherham - 1837. Butcher, Wm (~, File & Edge Tool Mnfr). Address: 41 & 44 Eyre Lane Hs. Stanton Broom, Glossop Rd, in 1841. Recorded in: Henry & Thos. Rodgers Sheff & Roth Directory - 1841. Butcher, William & Samuel (, Edge tool maker(s)). Address: Eyre Lane and Furnival Street, Sheffield in 1846. Recorded in: Slaters 1846 Directory, Sheffield. Butcher, William & Samuel (, File Manufacturer(s)). Address: Eyre Lane and Furnival Street, Sheffield in 1846. Recorded in: Slaters 1846 Directory, Sheffield. Butcher, William & Samuel (, Merchant(s), factor(s) and manufacturer(s)). Address: Eyre Lane and Furnival Street, Sheffield in 1846. Recorded in: Slaters 1846 Directory, Sheffield. Butcher, William & Samuel (, pen and pocket knife manufacturer). Address: Eyre Lane and Furnival Street, Sheffield in 1846. Recorded in: Slaters 1846 Directory, Sheffield. Butcher, William & Samuel (, razor manufacturer). Address: Eyre Lane and Furnival Street, Sheffield in 1846. Recorded in: Slaters 1846 Directory, Sheffield. Butcher, William & Samuel (, rolling mills). Address: Philadelphia, Sheffield in 1846. Recorded in: Slaters 1846 Directory, Sheffield. Butcher, William & Samuel (, steel converters and refiners). Address: Eyre Lane;Furnival Street and Philadelphia steel works, Sheffield in 1846. Recorded in: Slaters 1846 Directory, Sheffield. Butcher, William & Samuel (, Table knife manufacturers). Address: Eyre Lane & Furnival Street, Sheffield in 1846. Recorded in: Slaters 1846 Directory, Sheffield. Butcher, William & Samuel (, Joiners Tool Maker(s)). Address: Eyre Lane, Sheffield in 1846. Recorded in: Slaters 1846 Directory, Sheffield. Butcher, William and Samuel (, Merchant and steel, edgetool, file, razor, saw &c. manufacturer and tilters). Address: 41 Eyre Lane and Philadelphia Steel Works, in 1852. Recorded in: White's Gazetteer & General Directory of Sheffield - 1852. Butcher, William Esq (, Merchant & manufacturer). Address: h. Five Oaks, Glossop Road, in 1852. Recorded in: White's Gazetteer & General Directory of Sheffield - 1852. Butcher, W & S (, File Manufrs). Address: 13 Furnival Street, in 1871. Recorded in: White's Sheffield & Dist. Directory - 1871. Butcher, W.&S. (, Merchants & Manufacturers). Address: 41 Eyre Lane, in 1871. Recorded in: White's Sheffield & Dist. Directory - 1871. Butcher, W.& S. (, manufacturers of steel,files,tools etc.). Address: 41 Eyre Lane & 72 Arundel Street, in 1905. Recorded in: Whites Directory of Sheffield & Rotherham. Butcher, Charles F. (, (W.& S.)). Address: h.Richmond Hill near Handsworth, in 1905. Recorded in: Whites Directory of Sheffield & Rotherham. Butcher, Charles Fosbery (, manufacturer Sheffield). Address: h. Richmond Hill Richmond Handsworth, in 1905. Recorded in: Whites Directory of Sheffield & Rotherham. We can see that they were based in several addresses on Eyre Street along with other places. Also “W&S” was first referenced in the 1837, while William Butcher & C was mentioned in 1833. 1846 was the first reference to “pen and pocket knives” and was “Charles Fosbery Butcher” in charge of the company for the association with “Wade”. Kalfred
  18. Hello Edmund, have you anymore info on James Blyde and Percy Smith. I could not find the reference with Google. It is difficult to work out when and how said Percy Smith got in with James Blyde in the first place and in fact with which James. I have been thinking there was in fact a 2nd James Blyde and Son. Possibly after James (1803) split with John, he continued James and Son with James (1833),  but this is very muddy "Don" water.



  19. Hello again, usual thing looking for one thing and find something else. All through the history with the "Blydes" are references to scissors and here is that "JNO" mark on a pair. I found some more scissors listed on line. Picture below. We see "John Blyde" on this pair. I think they were around a 5 inch pair and wondered if they were from a period up to 1899 death of "John". Anybody with ideas on that? Kalfred
  20. Hello, I have tried to sort a little “Blyde” company history around “Adrians” JNO knife, but to be truthful I wish I had let the confusion of “Blydes” bide. I have worked with a sketchy Blyde skeleton I formed out of the “Ancestry” cupboard. It seems from an 1876 advert that the progenitor company for the manufacture of “Adrians” knife was James Blyde and Son; the company had been established in 1841. Subsequently, the company became “John Blyde Ltd”. Well that’s clear isn’t it? Unfortunately, the first “James”, begat another “James” and subsequently a “John”. So who is the son then? The original “James Blyde” was possibly Sheffield born in 1803 and in 1841 he was described as a scissor smith. At that time he had a daughter “Sarah Ann”, 3 male children, the James aged 14, the John aged 8 and a William aged 2. In 1851 he had a daughter now “Sarah Edison”, with James, William Edwin, Edwin and an Eliza Ann. Confusingly, James is now said to be 17 and where has John gone? Something seems strange here and below is a mini grid concerning the old James Blydes first 2 sons. To me there is a mistake in the ages given in the 1841 census. The ages are transposed. John is the firstborn and James the second born. “James Blyde and Son” is father, James, and firstborn son John, and as you would expect John took over the concern. Apparently in the 1861 census John is married and a “hardware manufacturer” employing 8 men and 2 boys. He has a son “Arthur J.” aged 4. We see an “Arthur Jno” again in the 1881 census, when 24, and working, probably, as a “general clerk cutlery manufacturers”. The old “James” in 1861 was described as a scissor finisher and in 1871 and 1881 he is called retired”. Taking information from the ad I first mentioned (and confirming Johnm’s imput), the corporate mark was then the word “GENIUS” under a pictorial planet “Saturn” and the products are described as high quality scissors and they are also producers of specialist equine scissors and grooming tools. The address given was “Clintock Works” at 72 and 74 Burgess St. Sheffield”. In subsequent history “Clintock Works” has another address. By 1883, the business is said to have moved to Clintock Works, Milton Street. That Genius mark does not appear to be on Adrian’s penknife blades but it is regularly seen on Razor blades and it may be the matter of blade size? A couple of marks shown are below, including one on a spoon (the latter is just for me and the less cut throat readers). On a 2nd trade ad, this one from 1921 “John Blyde Ltd” describe themselves as cutlery specialists including offering pen and pocket knives (the ad is a bit like “Johnm’s” ad shown earlier in this post). This is more the age of Adrian’s knife and “Genius” was shown on the ad as a trademark (not corporate mark this time) and with the statement it was granted by the “Cutlery Company” in 1865. Adrian’s knife carries that other trademark, the “Golfer” that goes with the “Sure and Far” logo. I found a creditable reference relating to the “Golfer” pictorial mark and it said that the mark belonged to “A.J.Blyde” of Clintock Works Sheffield. Now, there is a familiar name again, the 1881 referenced son of John Blyde. John Blyde died in December 1899 and a Sheffield newspaper report concerning his funeral is listed in another post on the Forum (I will reference it at the end). My quick synopsis is that John was taken ill on his way to work and later died. He leaves a Son, “Arthur Blyde” who will likely carry on the business. We are now coming to the period of that nice utility knife pictured at the start of Adrian’s post. “Strazors.com” gives a reference (probably the same as Johnm’s above) which says A.J. Blyde died in 1920 but the firm continued, including absorbing “Greenhoughs” and it famously made quality hand forged surgical scissors and pen and pocket knives. It would be good to know what if any “Blyde” name was used after 1920 but they closed in the 1970’s. Any corrections or additions welcomed. Both the ads I quote from can be found via Graces Guides. The forum John Blyde funeral reference is in W Gillott & Son in Sheffield History Chat And that particular post has references to some of the other members of the original James Blydes family. There may be enough for another post! Kalfred Just an extra photo of tableware "items" with the John Blyde name. First half of the 20th century is a likely date.
  21. Hello. I was interested in the "Blydes" and came across this post, one of several posts relating these Sheffield makers. I have an electroplate mark on a spoon I want to add somewhere when I work out which "Blyde" it belongs to. I was looking at the Sheffield Indexers" and came to "Blyde Jno". I have seen the "Jno" with other names. What Christian name do we think it represents? Is it "Jonathon"? Or is it what they can see from the origional record? I was trying to get a date order of the Blydes. "Jno" was about 50 years earlier than "Adrian's" great penknife. We can positively date the knife blade to 1927, as that lower case "k" tells us that. It is not 1952 as which has an upper case "K". 1902 had a lower case "k" but it was in "fancy style" that my lap top does not know how to reproduce. That was a smart bit of work Adrian to find E.W.Oakes. Is it acceptable if I pass your hallmark image on further to be confirmed and likely recorded on line for the world to know (if they care to search)? Kalfred
  22. Hope somehow this "stuff" gets back to Sheffield and can be seen. Kalfred
  23. I saw on line a nice image of a box and its 6 table knives that I thought some members of the forum might find of interest. I had a quick look to see if they would make a relevant addition to somebody else’s post. I did at first cause myself a problem by looking for “Wolstenholme George” in the search field but a helpful post I found told me the “e” at the end of the surname had been dropped. I looked carefully at my saved image again and saw I needed to be searching for “George Wostenholm” because not only was there no “e” but also no first “l”. Thus here I am with these, perhaps, less exciting knives but with a fantastic mini catalogue of some of the specialist items the company made. After trawling for my “G.W” on the forum I found I had a bit of confusion in my mind and felt a little bit of research was still needed. From our own forum I found the reference that “George Wostenholm, cutler's mark granted 22/12/1694” Then however it also seems that the Sheffield company of George Wolstenholme (born 1717 possibly) developed in 1745 though at Stannington just outside the City. George’s son Henry carried the business on until 1803 when George’s grandson, George 2, took over. The company moved to Sheffield, premises being called “Rockingham Works”, largely making razors and penknives. The difficulty of getting the “Wolstenholme” name on the latter’s small blades necessitated the shorter “Wostenholm” surname being generated. The 2nd George was in partnership with his own son George 3 in 1825 but died 1834 and the original George’s great grandson, George 3 carried on. Although I think there were too many “Georges” in this company, this George 3 installed the company into a new purpose built premises, Washington Works. This name was possibly chosen because of the large number of specialist knives that they sold to the USA. The reference below may be interesting. https://www.sheffieldhistory.co.uk/forums/topic/3082-hibbard-spencer-and-bartlett/?do=findComment&comment=13410 The company became “Ltd.” in 1875 but George 3 appears to have died in 1876, leaving a widow and no children. A reference said that for the years 1876-1880 the company gave annual average dividends of 10% on average profits of £10203. Just before WWI a “Thomas Gilbert Wolstenholme” came to the leadership of the company and made changes to take the company further into the 20th century. Things did not all go totally smoothly and there was even a misfortune in that damage occurred to the “Washington Works” due to WW2 bombing. Below are a couple more images for “Wostenholm and Son”. We have the cutlery box as shown previously plus another box and markings on the different blades they contained. If you look at the close up of the 2 boxes you can see the manufacturer’s name is described differently. The greenish box with the “Tally Ho!” trademark on has the company name “George Wostenholm & Son Ltd” while the other box lid has the company name “George Wostenholm & Son’s”. This could be dating evidence for the 2 lots of knives. My original thought was that “& Son’s” must have been later but then I remembered my English grammar and worked out it was cutlery “belonging” to only one son. I think the “Ltd” with the “Firth Stainless” knives is the most recent item but they may in fact not be very far apart in age. In 1971 another big Sheffield player “Joseph Rodgers” took over “Wostenholm” but in 1986 that pair along with their trademarks were part of the “Egginton Group”. This might be an example of “what goes around, comes around”. The “Tally Ho!” mark was bought by George 3 in 1860 from “M.Hunter’s”, he with his father having in 1826 already obtained their knife famed “I*XL” (I excel) trademark and in 1843 he had bought “The Pipe Trade Mark”. That mark being the “oldest cutlery trademark on the Register of the Sheffield Cutlers’ Company” and granted in 1694. Funny that year appears familia! Now, if the old company’s history was confusing with “Georges”, then the 20th history seems no different to me. Along with the Egginton Group claiming “Wostenholm” history another company established 1993, “TGW International” claims the same history. This latter company had its seed in the Wostenholm’s concern nurtured from 1908 by the “Thomas Gilbert Wolstenholme” noted earlier. Hopefully the “Big Players on The Forum” can sort this out for us. Kalfred
  24. Thanks Boginspro, I've tried with that map web site again and I think the "Roses" area was nearer to where the Winter Garden and the Mercure Hotel complex stand now.
  25. Thank you Boginspro and Edmund for bulking out my post. That old map web site you have referenced looks a very useful tool. It shows that the “Eyre Street” reference is in fact the road, next along, from Norfolk Lane so there must have been a chunk of buildings around there used over time by Lewis Rose. Am I correct in thinking that the University area is where “Roses” were? That 1957 picture of the chap at the Bowling Green Street works is very interesting as 21 Bowling Green Street was the address of the “Philip Ashberry” concern that “Roses” took over in 1935 (including knocking it down) and then developed post WW11.