Royal Antediluvian Order Of Buffaloes

[Oldbloke]

Following the interest in the "Buffs" in an earlier topic I thought this might be of interest. While sorting through some of my things I came across a 1908 Directory and have transcribed the lodges in Sheffield and the pubs that hosted their meetings.

R.A.O.B. Minor Lodges in Sheffield 1908

4 Shakesperian, Garrick Hotel Sycamore Street

34 David Garrick, Star and Garter Winter Street

85 Sir Thomas Slater, West End Hotel Glossop Road

118 Nil Desperandum, Crown and Anchor Hotel Fitzwilliam Street

121 Hope and Prosper, Earl of Arundel Queens Road

144 Beaconsfield, Fleur de Lis Hotel Fargate

163 Royal Jubilee, Bridge Inn Weedon Street

176 Stanley, Falstaff Inn Wicker

418 Sir Howard Vincent, Empire Hotel Charles Street

506 Herbert Gillatt, Sheffield Moor Hotel South Street Moor

576 Wharncliffe, Cambridge Hotel Cambridge Street

584 Fitzwilliam, Castle Inn Dykes Hall Road

585 Sir John Wardiingley, Sawmakers Arms Neepsend Lane

619 Sir Henry Watson, Ranmoor Inn Ranmoor

648 George Wolstenholme, Crown Inn London Road

660 Coronet (late Dusty Miller) Norfolk Inn Clarence Street

679 Cecil, Crown Inn Albert Road Heeley

687 Sir John Parsonage, Theatre Tavern Arundel Street

700 Sir A Smith, Bath Hotel Victoria Street

707 Whittle, Cutlers Arms Hotel Worksop Road nr Sheffield

725 Excelsior, Sheffield and Heeley House Gleadless nr Sheffield

782 Crown, Shrewsbury Hotel South Street Park

798 Lord Methuen, Yew Tree Inn Malin Bridge

818 Philanthropy, Industry Inn Broad Street Park

823 Sir Robert J Gilbert, Cromwell View Hotel Spital Street

830 Brincliffe, Broadfield Hotel Abbeydale Road

838 Chantry, Sportsman Inn Harvey Clough Road

856 Sir John Drake, Wellington HOtel Grimesthorpe Road

873 Sir William Wilson, New Market Hotel Sheaf Street

874 Friends of Freedom, Engineers Hotel Wincobank

879 Our Boys (late Owlerton), Original Grindstone Crookes

880 Otter, Pheasant Inn, Carbrook

892 Good Hope, Bridge Inn Nursery Street

900 Volunteer, Greyhound Hotel Gibralter Street

901 Adelaide, Queen Adelaide Bramall Lane

915 Union Jack, Inkerman Tavern Alma Street

917 Primrose, Shakespeare Hotel Well Road Heeley

918 Hillsboro', Hillsboro' Inn Hillsboro'

935 Sir Reginald Lawton, Lodge Inn Newhall Road

939 Sir R Wilson Marsh, White Hart Hotel Russell Street

949 Empire, Normanton Inn Grimesthorpe Road

950 Langton, Ball Inn Main Road Darnall

951 Pride of Darnall, Duke of York Hotel

956 Parkwood, Parkwood Hotel

968 Good Will, Ball Inn Heeley Bar

969 Ruskin (late Westby Bagshaw) Mount Pleasant Hotel Derbyshire Lane

991 Hampton, Talbot Hotel Talbot Road Park

997 Howard, Howard Hotel Howard Street

1000 Earl Marshall, Ball Inn Upwell Street Grimesthorpe

1009 Crookes, Howard Hotel Walkley

1011 Lord Alverstone, Cannon Hotel Castle Street

1016 King's Own, Rose and Crown Darnall

1030 Hallam (late Black Boy) Bal Inn Crookes

1088 Woodseats, Masons Arms Woodseats

1089 Norfolk, Baltic Hotel Effingham Road

Provincial Grand Lodge Fleur-de-Lis Hotel Fargate

[DaveH]

Following the interest in the "Buffs" in an earlier topic I thought this might be of interest. While sorting through some of my things I came across a 1908 Directory and have transcribed the lodges in Sheffield and the pubs that hosted their meetings.

Thanks for posting this list Oldbloke.

I remember the discussions about the "Buffs" (RAOB) in the earlier topic and I learnt quite a lot from it.

I suppose, along with the pubs list, cinemas list, schools list etc we could develop this into a complete list of all know RAOB lodges in the Sheffield area.

[RichardB]

Thank you Oldbloke; 1908 sounds like one for Stuart once he's done with ... well, more of that later

I came across a 1908 Directory.

[DaveH]

Thank you Oldbloke; 1908 sounds like one for Stuart once he's done with ... well, more of that later

...once he's done with 1907? :unsure:

[RichardB]

1904 but that's a secret as you well know Dave.

...once he's done with 1907?

[DaveH]

1904 but that's a secret as you well know Dave.

I'd better not mention the time machine we have just invented then.

[Oldbloke]

There are very few lodges left in the Sheffield, area now.The Shakesperian No 4 has now changed it's name, but as far as I know is the oldest Lodge in the world still functioning. I was the secretary when it celebrated it's 120th anniversary about 20 years ago. The Hope and Prosper Lodge No 121 was amalgamated with the Shakesperian some time in the early to mid 1980s when it's membership dwindled to about 5 regulars.

I have another Lodge directory from the 1930s, but I can't find the thing at the moment. It will be interesting to compare not only the number of Lodges, but of pubs around Sheffield too.

I'm currently trying to find out details about the Carlisle Lodge No 2264. I think it was founded on October 26th 1917, as my Great Grandfather joined on that date, it would seem on the opening night. I have his Knight Order of Merit Jewel from 1935, handed down to me by my father, who was also a Buff. How many more generations of Buffs there were in the family is unknown though.

[DaveH]

The Shakesperian No 4 has now changed it's name, but as far as I know is the oldest Lodge in the world still functioning. I was the secretary when it celebrated it's 120th anniversary about 20 years ago.

Now there is a revelation.

The oldest still active RAOB lodge in the World could be in Sheffield.

[syrup]

Sadly not Sheffield unless you just count England.

http://edibwestprovraob.co.uk/#/royal-edinburgh/4546932570

[DaveH]

Sadly not Sheffield unless you just count England.

http://edibwestprovr...urgh/4546932570

As an ANTEDILUVIAN society they should, going on the name, pre-date Noah's Biblical Old Testament flood.

We should be looking at thousands of years BC.

However, discounting that (I am sure the name was derived by some other means) it would be interesting to know how long the RAOB has actually been around as an organisation as this may be a clue to locating the oldest lodge.

[Oldbloke]

The Order was formed in the 1820s. The Shakesperian Lodge No 1 (Before renumbering about 1900 in which it became No 4) was formed in 1870 according to the original dispensation (now in the Grand Lodge Museum at Grove House in Harrogate I believe).

There is a book by Bro Mervyn Payne detailing the history of the Order, in which he traces it's beginings and development. A breif version is available from http://www.raob.org/download/history.pdf

[DaveH]

The Order was formed in the 1820s. The Shakesperian Lodge No 1 (Before renumbering about 1900 in which it became No 4) was formed in 1870 according to the original dispensation (now in the Grand Lodge Museum at Grove House in Harrogate I believe).

There is a book by Bro Mervyn Payne detailing the history of the Order, in which he traces it's beginings and development. A breif version is available from http://www.raob.org/...oad/history.pdf

Excellent link to some very interesting information there Oldbloke.

However, -

If someone asks me not to ask an obvious question that is going begging with the phrase "don't ask" or "don't ask why" I always see it as some sort of provocation into a "hidden story"

So why is a first degree RAOB member called a "Kangaroo"?

[Oldbloke]

If someone asks me not to ask an obvious question that is going begging with the phrase "don't ask" or "don't ask why" I always see it as some sort of provocation into a "hidden story"

So why is a first degree RAOB member called a "Kangaroo"?

I'm of the same persuasion myself, however in this case it may just be that the author of that piece doesn't know, I'm sure that I have read an explanation / reason somewhere, but can't bring it to mind at the moment.

[syrup]

Excellent link to some very interesting information there Oldbloke.

However, -

If someone asks me not to ask an obvious question that is going begging with the phrase "don't ask" or "don't ask why" I always see it as some sort of provocation into a "hidden story"

So why is a first degree RAOB member called a "Kangaroo"?

The RAOB is made up of Four Degrees of membership. These being the interestingly named Kangaroo or first degree. Kangaroo is said to come from the fact that a first degree brother will metaphorically "hop" from one position in the lodge to the next so as to learn the ropes of the lodge. The Kangaroo degree is also named, probably because the early rituals or roles of the buffalo society having been written by comedian's and actors and done for laughs (it was a jovial social club of actors remember) was just that, a bit of a laugh. Now its become firmly implanted in buffalo folk lore and the presentation of a kangaroo jewel signifys that a brother has done much work in his minor lodge.

http://www.freemasons.co.nz/forum/viewtopic.php?f=3&t=217

[Guest Denthedec]

Hi Oldbloke

This is my first post on here, so sorry if I have put it in the wrong place.

In your post you mentioned you have an old RAOB Directory from 1908.

I do a lot of research into the order and finding Directories of that era is very hard.

Would you consider loaning it? I promise to take care of it I just would like to copy all the Lodge names.

I will pay all postage costs.

I do have a very large list of Lodges that came under the Shefield Province That I could post on here if thats ok (Not compared it to yours yet I am sure there will be some more for me to add)

Many thanks

Bro Den Whittenbury ROH

[Guest Denthedec]

There are very few lodges left in the Sheffield, area now.The Shakesperian No 4 has now changed it's name, but as far as I know is the oldest Lodge in the world still functioning. I was the secretary when it celebrated it's 120th anniversary about 20 years ago. The Hope and Prosper Lodge No 121 was amalgamated with the Shakesperian some time in the early to mid 1980s when it's membership dwindled to about 5 regulars.

I have another Lodge directory from the 1930s, but I can't find the thing at the moment. It will be interesting to compare not only the number of Lodges, but of pubs around Sheffield too.

I'm currently trying to find out details about the Carlisle Lodge No 2264. I think it was founded on October 26th 1917, as my Great Grandfather joined on that date, it would seem on the opening night. I have his Knight Order of Merit Jewel from 1935, handed down to me by my father, who was also a Buff. How many more generations of Buffs there were in the family is unknown though.

I think you are right with the date for that Lodge opening as the 2149 was opened in 14 July 1916 and the 2274 was opened on the 3rd Nov 1917 (Both in the Middlesborough Province)As far as I can work out the Lodge closed by 1949

[Oldbloke]

Hi Den,

All my stuff is boxed and stored again at the moment. I'm so unorganised that I have no idea what is where.

I'm reluctant to let the directories out of my possession, though I have thought about taking the time to scan them, which seems a better solution.

Bro Oldbloke KOM :unsure:

[Guest Denthedec]

Hi Den,

All my stuff is boxed and stored again at the moment. I'm so unorganised that I have no idea what is where.

I'm reluctant to let the directories out of my possession, though I have thought about taking the time to scan them, which seems a better solution.

Bro Oldbloke KOM

That's ok I fully understand. I dont like loaning them out either.

If you want to email me denthedec sky.com I will copy over the Lodge names I have for Shefield (over 250 Lodges inc name changes)

Den

[RichardB]

There is a trustworthy chap on here sometimes scans the occasional page for me ...

If your stuff is boxed and stored then you are streets ahead of me !

Hi Den,

All my stuff is boxed and stored again at the moment. I'm so unorganised that I have no idea what is where.

I'm reluctant to let the directories out of my possession, though I have thought about taking the time to scan them, which seems a better solution.

Bro Oldbloke KOM

[Stuart0742]

That's ok I fully understand. I dont like loaning them out either.

If you want to email me denthedec sky.com I will copy over the Lodge names I have for Shefield (over 250 Lodges inc name changes)

Den

Don't know if there is anything that might interest you in this topic Den

The scans were taken from our 1904 copy of the Sheffield Red Book

The entire book is here

[Stuart0742]

There is a trustworthy chap on here sometimes scans the occasional page for me ...

Mr Scan the man who Scans lol

[DaveH]

Mr Scan the man who Scans

AKA Stuart0742

Perhaps you should change your username?

Or open a second account just for being our scannerman with.

[syrup]

On 10/24/2011 at 13:16, Oldbloke said:

Following the interest in the "Buffs" in an earlier topic I thought this might be of interest. While sorting through some of my things I came across a 1908 Directory and have transcribed the lodges in Sheffield and the pubs that hosted their meetings.

 

R.A.O.B. Minor Lodges in Sheffield 1908

 

4 Shakesperian, Garrick Hotel Sycamore Street

34 David Garrick, Star and Garter Winter Street

85 Sir Thomas Slater, West End Hotel Glossop Road

118 Nil Desperandum, Crown and Anchor Hotel Fitzwilliam Street

121 Hope and Prosper, Earl of Arundel Queens Road

144 Beaconsfield, Fleur de Lis Hotel Fargate

163 Royal Jubilee, Bridge Inn Weedon Street

176 Stanley, Falstaff Inn Wicker

418 Sir Howard Vincent, Empire Hotel Charles Street

506 Herbert Gillatt, Sheffield Moor Hotel South Street Moor

576 Wharncliffe, Cambridge Hotel Cambridge Street

584 Fitzwilliam, Castle Inn Dykes Hall Road

585 Sir John Wardiingley, Sawmakers Arms Neepsend Lane

619 Sir Henry Watson, Ranmoor Inn Ranmoor

648 George Wolstenholme, Crown Inn London Road

660 Coronet (late Dusty Miller) Norfolk Inn Clarence Street

679 Cecil, Crown Inn Albert Road Heeley

687 Sir John Parsonage, Theatre Tavern Arundel Street

700 Sir A Smith, Bath Hotel Victoria Street

707 Whittle, Cutlers Arms Hotel Worksop Road nr Sheffield

725 Excelsior, Sheffield and Heeley House Gleadless nr Sheffield

782 Crown, Shrewsbury Hotel South Street Park

798 Lord Methuen, Yew Tree Inn Malin Bridge

818 Philanthropy, Industry Inn Broad Street Park

823 Sir Robert J Gilbert, Cromwell View Hotel Spital Street

830 Brincliffe, Broadfield Hotel Abbeydale Road

838 Chantry, Sportsman Inn Harvey Clough Road

856 Sir John Drake, Wellington HOtel Grimesthorpe Road

873 Sir William Wilson, New Market Hotel Sheaf Street

874 Friends of Freedom, Engineers Hotel Wincobank

879 Our Boys (late Owlerton), Original Grindstone Crookes

880 Otter, Pheasant Inn, Carbrook

892 Good Hope, Bridge Inn Nursery Street

900 Volunteer, Greyhound Hotel Gibralter Street

901 Adelaide, Queen Adelaide Bramall Lane

915 Union Jack, Inkerman Tavern Alma Street

917 Primrose, Shakespeare Hotel Well Road Heeley

918 Hillsboro', Hillsboro' Inn Hillsboro'

935 Sir Reginald Lawton, Lodge Inn Newhall Road

939 Sir R Wilson Marsh, White Hart Hotel Russell Street

949 Empire, Normanton Inn Grimesthorpe Road

950 Langton, Ball Inn Main Road Darnall

951 Pride of Darnall, Duke of York Hotel

956 Parkwood, Parkwood Hotel

968 Good Will, Ball Inn Heeley Bar

969 Ruskin (late Westby Bagshaw) Mount Pleasant Hotel Derbyshire Lane

991 Hampton, Talbot Hotel Talbot Road Park

997 Howard, Howard Hotel Howard Street

1000 Earl Marshall, Ball Inn Upwell Street Grimesthorpe

1009 Crookes, Howard Hotel Walkley

1011 Lord Alverstone, Cannon Hotel Castle Street

1016 King's Own, Rose and Crown Darnall

1030 Hallam (late Black Boy) Bal Inn Crookes

1088 Woodseats, Masons Arms Woodseats

1089 Norfolk, Baltic Hotel Effingham Road

 

Provincial Grand Lodge Fleur-de-Lis Hotel Fargate

Its nice to see a mention of  585 Sir John Wardiingley, Sawmakers Arms Neepsend Lane as that would be local to my Great grandfathers Business

perhaps some one could add any information as to what he would have done as a Primo in The RAOB.

Here are some Photos of His Jewel and a Transcript of a E-Mail from RAOB after my inquiry.   

Thank you for your e-mail. The reason you will not have had a response from Terry Peters is that he is no longer curator of the RAOB Museum. At the present time a replacement has yet to be appointed.

Moving on to the jewel – I must confess that initially the photograph threw me as the design is completely unlike any of the current designs for Second Degree jewels in any of the various Banners of the RAOB. At first glance I thought it belonged to a Grand Council Lodge of the RAOB as they have used red ribbons on their jewels for Primos where the Grand Lodge of England uses Royal Blue. The lettering round the centre of the pendant does of course confirm it is GLE. However in the early years of the Order Lodges and Provinces were permitted to have jewels made to their own specifications for presentation to members raised to higher Degrees. It was not until 1922 that a rule was introduced whereby all such jewels had to be ordered through the Grand Lodge and thus introduced uniformity. The Lodges were also allowed to obtain these jewels in base metal, silver or gold the choice being governed mainly by the amount of money in the Lodge Funds. Most jewels today are either metal gilt or silver gilt. A few are occasionally made of gold for very special occasions.

The records for 1902 are, as you might imagine, quite sketchy. What I have managed to discover that the “Sir John Wardingley Lodge No 585” was founded in 1899 and came under the authority of the Sheffield Provincial Grand Lodge. At some later date the Lodge name was changed to the “Harvest Lodge”. There could have been any number of reasons for this but only original minute books for that era would tell us why. There are no minutes books available as far as I can ascertain.

I assume from the photographs that the jewel pendant is solid silver. If so it will be reasonably valuable but that value would be I believe greater to a collector because of its individual design. It is probably quite a rare item. The jewellers who made such items were usually local to the Lodges so “J Davis” may not have produced many of this particular design and possibly only for one or two Lodges. Some will have been lost others sold for their scrap value or melted down to make something else, all of which will increase the value of the surviving jewels. Plus of course your Great Grandfather’s has been kept in its original case preserving the quality.

I trust the above provides some helpful background information for you.

Joseph Bailey GREEN
1848–1925
Born 16 Mar 1848
Thornhill Lees

 

[lysander]

I used to drink the occasional "gallon" in a pub( The Harlequin) which had a lodge,. All I can recall was that they tended to be old blokes who looked rather silly as they made their way upstairs to the meeting ,only to look even sillier a while later as they gathered around the bar for a final drink before heading home. That said, they looked no sillier than those members of the more middle class Masons!.... After a little bit of googling I was surprised to learn that the Buffs are still in existence.

[Oldbloke]

On 02/03/2017 at 17:42, syrup said:

Its nice to see a mention of  585 Sir John Wardiingley, Sawmakers Arms Neepsend Lane as that would be local to my Great grandfathers Business

perhaps some one could add any information as to what he would have done as a Primo in The RAOB.

Thank you for your e-mail. The reason you will not have had a response from Terry Peters is that he is no longer curator of the RAOB Museum. At the present time a replacement has yet to be appointed.

Moving on to the jewel – I must confess that initially the photograph threw me as the design is completely unlike any of the current designs for Second Degree jewels in any of the various Banners of the RAOB. At first glance I thought it belonged to a Grand Council Lodge of the RAOB as they have used red ribbons on their jewels for Primos where the Grand Lodge of England uses Royal Blue. The lettering round the centre of the pendant does of course confirm it is GLE. However in the early years of the Order Lodges and Provinces were permitted to have jewels made to their own specifications for presentation to members raised to higher Degrees. It was not until 1922 that a rule was introduced whereby all such jewels had to be ordered through the Grand Lodge and thus introduced uniformity. The Lodges were also allowed to obtain these jewels in base metal, silver or gold the choice being governed mainly by the amount of money in the Lodge Funds. Most jewels today are either metal gilt or silver gilt. A few are occasionally made of gold for very special occasions.

The records for 1902 are, as you might imagine, quite sketchy. What I have managed to discover that the “Sir John Wardingley Lodge No 585” was founded in 1899 and came under the authority of the Sheffield Provincial Grand Lodge. At some later date the Lodge name was changed to the “Harvest Lodge”. There could have been any number of reasons for this but only original minute books for that era would tell us why. There are no minutes books available as far as I can ascertain.

I assume from the photographs that the jewel pendant is solid silver. If so it will be reasonably valuable but that value would be I believe greater to a collector because of its individual design. It is probably quite a rare item. The jewellers who made such items were usually local to the Lodges so “J Davis” may not have produced many of this particular design and possibly only for one or two Lodges. Some will have been lost others sold for their scrap value or melted down to make something else, all of which will increase the value of the surviving jewels. Plus of course your Great Grandfather’s has been kept in its original case preserving the quality.

I trust the above provides some helpful background information for you.

Joseph Bailey GREEN
1848–1925
Born 16 Mar 1848
Thornhill Lees

 

Sorry, I haven't been around a lot lately. As a Primo, he would have passed "Examining Council" and proved a knowledge of the R.A.O.B rules and customs. When he had been through his raising ceremony and received his Primo's credentials he would be eligible to be the chairman of lodge meetings.

I don't have my Great Grandfather's (2nd Degree) Primo Jewel (1919), but am told that was also solid silver. I do have his (3rd Degree) Knight Jewel (1935) and that is solid gold.